Need some advice..

fence_dweller · Oct 6, 2009

Hello Everyone I am new to bayoushooter... I myself am not an avid gun person, but my Fiance is. That is what I actually need advice on.. He insists on carrying a loaded gun on his hip at ALL times! Now being from a family who never had guns this makes me quite uncomfortable. Now I have been to the shooting range with him and do not mind shooting rifles, shot guns (i actually enjoy it) and what not, but i am having a hard time justifying having a gun on you at ALL times. ESP when I have a 3 year old daughter, who gets into everything who lives with us. Now when we go somewhere it is not allowed, it is left in the car out of sight. Also he carries it on him at his job, where he works with his uncle at his workshop, in a very safe part of the city! I have asked him to not carry it around me and my daughter but he refuses. I do not know what to do about this and need some advice on what to do. :confused:

My reasoning in thinking carrying is not neccasry at all times is b/c i have read so many news stories where the person with the weapon gets shot at and killed b/c the criminal sees they have a weapon or their weapon being used against them, and all the news articles about how small children and toddlers get into family members weapons and shooting themselves in the face make me very nervous. Also in my 31 years on this earth never felt like I needed a weapon to defend myself, so maybe i just do not get why he feels the need to have one at all times. Maybe I have more faith in people than he does.

SO my question to all of you is Do I have good enough reason to ask him not to carry it around me, or am I being a B*&$^ for asking him not to always carrry it? Are my feelings about not carrying justified or dumb and not accurate? NEED HELP!!
:confused:

spanky · Oct 6, 2009

There are so many points to address here so I'll try to do it chronologically.

A gun on you at all times becomes a comforting thing. Not so much in that you know you can face a problem if needed but in that, if a problem presents itself you know you can, at that point, protect yourself or your loved ones. A firearm does you no good if it's unloaded or not on you. We often preach the saying "better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it" and it's become a bit cliche' but it's far too true to overlook. Another equally over-used but applicable one is "When seconds count, the police are minutes away."

As far as a 3 year old, I can relate 100% as we have a 4 year old and another on the way very soon. Two things that you should keep in mind here. If the gun is on your fiancee's person then the child cannot get to it. Secondly, while it is not on his person you will want to keep it secured and out of reach. There are several companies that make bedside single gun safes that are very quick opening. Also, education goes a long way. Teach your child that guns are not to be touched, handled, etc without express permission. Don't scare the children or tell them not to ever touch it, etc because, well, I'm sure you know what curiosity does.

Your fiancee' has taken it upon himself to protect him, you, your family, his loved ones, etc. He realized that this is his duty. If you feel as though it's not, try taking a look at police response times in your area. Also, look up Warren v. D.C. (hotlinked for convenience). It's very eye opening. Nine times out of ten the police will not be there in time. Whether they are 2 minutes away or 5 minutes away or 30 minutes away, a minute is a long time. You should feel proud that he has taken it upon himself to take responsibility for those who he loves instead of feeling as though he should hand his lives over to police and, potentially, a cold blooded killer. As far as the "safe part of town" thing, well, that's hard to address because I can see it from your point of view but, at the same time, how on Earth are you going to know when you're going to need it? This goes back to the above statement about needing it and not having it.

As far as criminals taking guns, etc, etc, if he is carrying it concealed and he is practicing as he should be (maybe have him take a training class (and you, yourself, would benefit from one as well), the only time anyone will know he has a gun is when he is in the process of using it and, unless there are close quarters fighting and/or retention issues, that gun isn't going to be taken from him. That is a real possibility though and, as such, training and practice is key.

Are you a bitch for asking him not to carry it? No. You have some concerns that need to be addressed and that's what we're here for. Should not stop him or have his carrying affect your relationship? That's a personal choice but, in my opinion, that should be a strong no for the aforementioned reasons.

There are many people on this forum who will chime in, some men and some women. Some carry every second of the day (when feasible) and some only do it occasionally. The commonality here is that most people in the firearms and self defense aware community realize that the safety of their loved ones and themselves is in their hands.

Nolacopusmc · Oct 6, 2009

spanky said:
There are so many points to address here so I'll try to do it chronologically.

A gun on you at all times becomes a comforting thing. Not so much in that you know you can face a problem if needed but in that, if a problem presents itself you know you can, at that point, protect yourself or your loved ones. A firearm does you no good if it's unloaded or not on you. We often preach the saying "better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it" and it's become a bit cliche' but it's far too true to overlook. Another equally over-used but applicable one is "When seconds count, the police are minutes away."

As far as a 3 year old, I can relate 100% as we have a 4 year old and another on the way very soon. Two things that you should keep in mind here. If the gun is on your fiancee's person then the child cannot get to it. Secondly, while it is not on his person you will want to keep it secured and out of reach. There are several companies that make bedside single gun safes that are very quick opening. Also, education goes a long way. Teach your child that guns are not to be touched, handled, etc without express permission. Don't scare the children or tell them not to ever touch it, etc because, well, I'm sure you know what curiosity does.

Your fiancee' has taken it upon himself to protect him, you, your family, his loved ones, etc. He realized that this is his duty. If you feel as though it's not, try taking a look at police response times in your area. Also, look up Warren v. D.C. (hotlinked for convenience). It's very eye opening. Nine times out of ten the police will not be there in time. Whether they are 2 minutes away or 5 minutes away or 30 minutes away, a minute is a long time. You should feel proud that he has taken it upon himself to take responsibility for those who he loves instead of feeling as though he should hand his lives over to police and, potentially, a cold blooded killer. As far as the "safe part of town" thing, well, that's hard to address because I can see it from your point of view but, at the same time, how on Earth are you going to know when you're going to need it? This goes back to the above statement about needing it and not having it.

As far as criminals taking guns, etc, etc, if he is carrying it concealed and he is practicing as he should be (maybe have him take a training class (and you, yourself, would benefit from one as well), the only time anyone will know he has a gun is when he is in the process of using it and, unless there are close quarters fighting and/or retention issues, that gun isn't going to be taken from him. That is a real possibility though and, as such, training and practice is key.

Are you a bitch for asking him not to carry it? No. You have some concerns that need to be addressed and that's what we're here for. Should not stop him or have his carrying affect your relationship? That's a personal choice but, in my opinion, that should be a strong no for the aforementioned reasons.

There are many people on this forum who will chime in, some men and some women. Some carry every second of the day (when feasible) and some only do it occasionally. The commonality here is that most people in the firearms and self defense aware community realize that the safety of their loved ones and themselves is in their hands.

Great post Spanky.

I will add....

Do you only bring your spare tire along when you think you might really have a flat?

Do you fear that your house will catch on fire only because you have batteries in your detector?

Is your cellphone only turned on when you need to make a call, or do you keep it on incase a call comes in for you?

It is a matter of being prepared to handle a situation. teh gun is a tool. It gives you options, just like a flashlight, credit card, or cell phone. Tools that help you deal with life.

I think Spanky did an excellent job of addressing the child issue.

Tell you what, I am not sure where you are located, but I invite you to come to one of my Concealed Handgun classes free of charge. I think it will be an eye opening experience for you given some of the material specifically covered in my class.

homeslice · Oct 6, 2009

Plus 2 to both stated above. You simply can not overlook what the world is coming to these days. I look the same way at people that don't carry now... Kind of "how could you be so blind?"

If your parish publishes incident reports or you read the newspaper, that should be plenty of justification.

Manimal · Oct 6, 2009

fence_dweller said:
Hello Everyone I am new to bayoushooter... I myself am not an avid gun person, but my Fiance is. That is what I actually need advice on.. He insists on carrying a loaded gun on his hip at ALL times! Now being from a family who never had guns this makes me quite uncomfortable. Now I have been to the shooting range with him and do not mind shooting rifles, shot guns (i actually enjoy it) and what not, but i am having a hard time justifying having a gun on you at ALL times. ESP when I have a 3 year old daughter, who gets into everything who lives with us. Now when we go somewhere it is not allowed, it is left in the car out of sight. Also he carries it on him at his job, where he works with his uncle at his workshop, in a very safe part of the city! I have asked him to not carry it around me and my daughter but he refuses. I do not know what to do about this and need some advice on what to do. My reasoning in thinking carrying is not neccasry at all times is b/c i have read so many news stories where the person with the weapon gets shot at and killed b/c the criminal sees they have a weapon or their weapon being used against them, and all the news articles about how small children and toddlers get into family members weapons and shooting themselves in the face make me very nervous. Also in my 31 years on this earth never felt like I needed a weapon to defend myself, so maybe i just do not get why he feels the need to have one at all times. Maybe I have more faith in people than he does.

SO my question to all of you is Do I have good enough reason to ask him not to carry it around me, or am I being a B*&$^ for asking him not to always carrry it? Are my feelings about not carrying justified or dumb and not accurate? NEED HELP!!

To sum it up...if he is a person of rational mind, who is responsible, you have nothing to worry about on a daily basis as far as him carrying is concerned. If he is not, then you may be engaged to the wrong person anyway.

Most people who carry handguns do not think they will need them, but they have it just in case they do. We should never underestimate Free Will, or assume that we know the human mind. A person can just decide, randomly, to break in to your house and to kill your family...its just the randomness of life. Just like someone can randomly give a stranger a gift.

Many of us see guns as Tools, just like a Flashlight, or a Hammer.

If you accept him, accept what he does...and if he accepts you, so should he accept what you do.

I carry every day, everywhere, but I have great faith in humanity as a whole...I just know that not everyone shares this view and people can do what they want when they want, in the end.

Are you a bitch? It doesnt seem like it. Are your concerns valid? It's healthy to question things in life, but in the end I do not think that he is unreasonable. Validity is something that you will have to decide.

If he is responsible then your daughter should be in no more danger in any way.

If he gets drunk and still carries...that is a red flag. That would be a good enough reason to ask him not to carry, other than that...well, I wouldnt stop.

I dont like make up on a girl, but no girl has ever stopped wearing it for me...remember, a gun is a tool to many of us...make up is a tool as well. People must be willing participants, and sometimes we just want to feel good.

That make any sense?

Thanks for coming here and asking us our thoughts, thats so much better than actually being a bitch about it...you are trying to understand and learn, that is a beautiful thing.

p.s.
Ask him if he would get a Concealed Handgun Permit, or if he wold simply conceal in the house so you dont have to look at it...if you want.

smith625 · Oct 6, 2009

It is always better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6!!

grits · Oct 6, 2009

I'd rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it.

jgreco15 · Oct 6, 2009

fence_dweller, you seem to be a carbon copy of my wife. in fact as i was reading your post, i even thought you might be my wife in disguise. she feels much the same way about this issue as you do. we have an almost 2 year old and almost all of the same issues have come up.

spanky as well as all of the others have done fantastic jobs answering to your post. i tell my wife that i hope to God that i never have to use my gun for defense purposes but i would want to die if anything ever happened to her or our son and i was defenseless. i've offered to buy her a gun of her own but she refuses based on the fact that she is afraid that our son could get into her purse and find it. she has even commented that she does not visit bad parts of town but i try and explain that sometime bad parts of town visit her part of town, specifically to commit crime.

have faith in him that he is only trying to protect you and your loved ones. be open to learning and talk openly about issues such as child protection.

Nolacopusmc · Oct 6, 2009

As an instructor, I of course had my wife go through the course and she hears it 1-2 times a month. SHe has her permit.

That being the case, she still does not carry a gun, but should a situation present itself, like evacuations, taking the dog out late at night, traveling out of town, she has the option to conceal a firearm.

She knows how to shoot most of my handguns, work my police radio, advise 911 properly should I have to defend our lives in such a manner that I am not shot by responding police and stand a better chance in court.

She knows why we choose the table and seating arrangement we do in restaurants. She understands how to respond should I engage someone and tell her to get down, or get behind me. We have a plan.

She still shops 9x a week, gets her nails and heir did, and goes on with her life without a care in the world. However, she has the knowledge and capability to respond better than 90% of the population. She thinks I am too into guns and maybe a little paranoid, but she knows I am a police officer and am a little more aware, skeptical, and safety conscious than most.

You are getting great info here by the way. Good on you for trying to understand. Took my wife a while to understand why i view the world the way I do. Actually, watching the news for about two months and I had her screaming, "i can't believe these crazy mother...."

Then again, I live in a literal war zone.

grits · Oct 6, 2009

Nolacopusmc said:
She knows why we choose the table and seating arrangement we do in restaurants.

Something so simple, yet my wife thinks Im crazy about how I like to sit in a restaurant.

Manimal · Oct 6, 2009

grits said:
Something so simple, yet my wife thinks Im crazy about how I like to sit in a restaurant.

Yeah, my dates are often "Uh, OK?"...lol

jgreco15 · Oct 6, 2009

grits said:
Something so simple, yet my wife thinks Im crazy about how I like to sit in a restaurant.

my wife doesn't even notice when/why I pick certain tables or seating arangements. Good little thing I learned from my pops!

LACamper · Oct 6, 2009

Welcome to the site Fence_sitter!
When I was in college ( a long time ago!) I took a criminal justice course. As part of the course we went to the Slidell PD for a tour. We probably spent 40 minutes or so in the dispatch area. It was an eye-opener. The number of calls coming in were unbelievable (we picked a busy night, there were 2 high school games that night). In 40 minutes the 2 dispatchers handled at least 20 calls. There were 6 units on duty with one officer in each. At that rate there was no way they could handle all the calls. Also, some of the incoming calls were put on hold. Was someone bleeding to death while holding? Who knows, they were listening to hold recordings.
So, if you're the one on hold and someone is breaking in, do you want your husband to have that gun? Or do you want to hope that the dispatcher, whenever he or she finishes handling the call from the little old lady who is complaining about loud music and picks up to talk to you, can get a cop to your house in time?
There's another quote floating around: I carry a gun because I can't carry a cop in my pocket. Its true. All of us would rather have a cop deal with a problem than do it ourselves. Every time we draw that gun we're taking a chance. If we pull that trigger we're probably going to jail. We may get off, but we're going to spend a night or two in jail. Its going to cost money for attorneys. We'll be in the paper portrayed as a killer. We'll have to live with those events for the rest of our lives. But I'd do it in a minute to protect our families! A cop won't have those difficulties. I'd rather a cop deal with it. But if not I have alternatives...

BTW, don't take my word for it. Head to your nearest PD. Talk to them. They often have a summary of calls reported for a particular time available (LEO's jump in here...). Jefferson has an online reporting system by address that is viewable even. Get informed... Maybe there hasn't been a crime in your neighborhood in decades. I hope that's true. But I doubt it...

Cat · Oct 7, 2009

Hi Fence Dweller

I can understand your concern towards your young daughter. Many women on this site have young children as well. I suggest reading a wonderful website called Cornered Cat (No, I'm not the same "Cat") that deals specifically with being a safely armed mother. She preaches that best place to keep a hand gun, or pistol, with children present is actually on your hip. That way you know exactly where it's at and properly secure, and she'd have a hard time pulling it away from your body.

Guns can be scary if you're not used to them. And it sounds like your fiance' is making some pretty good decisions in showing you just how much fun shooting as sport can be.

Personally, I'd be more inclined to demand all guns must be out of the house unless he can provide a safe or locking case than I would be worried about him wearing one. They are infinitely much more dangerous tossed into a nightstand with curious three year olds than they are in by being properly carried on one's person.

fence_dweller · Oct 7, 2009

Thank you so very much for all the responses, it is all good info. I think i will ALWAYS feel uneasy about guns near and around me, but I understand most of the reasoning behind them.. All of you gave me a lot to digest and think about.. i really appreciate all the help!!!

fence_dweller · Oct 7, 2009

jgreco15 said:
my wife doesn't even notice when/why I pick certain tables or seating arangements. Good little thing I learned from my pops!

I notice

::wink wink::

jgreco15 · Oct 7, 2009

fence_dweller said:
I notice

::wink wink::

wow! your good. you really had me fooled.

flamatrix99 · Oct 7, 2009

grits said:
Something so simple, yet my wife thinks Im crazy about how I like to sit in a restaurant.

How do you choose to sit?? Never really heard anyone make a preference one way or another?

grits · Oct 7, 2009

I dont like sitting with my back to people. I also dont like sitting near the kitchen where someone can enter through a back door. Guess im a little paranoid.

jgreco15 · Oct 7, 2009

flamatrix99 said:
How do you choose to sit?? Never really heard anyone make a preference one way or another?

If you can sit in a position to see all of the exits and everyone around you, you should be one of the first people to see if something happens around you or at an exit/enterance.

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