If only everyone had electric cars...........

[BOSS302]

The article conveniently left out nuclear. The only true zero emission source of power. If they licensed more nuclear plants (A brand new dual unit reactor is about to open for the first time in 30 years) then the electric cars would be viable and the combination of both would drastically reduce emissions. Tesla is also working on a cobalt free battery that can go a million miles. That would change everything.

Too bad the AP1000 reactors at vogtle 3 and 4 were designed in the 70s. Just imagine a 21st century designed nuclear plant, it could be amazing.

 

[falshooter]

!

 

[AdvancedLaser]

Too bad the AP1000 reactors at vogtle 3 and 4 were designed in the 70s. Just imagine a 21st century designed nuclear plant, it could be amazing.

There are several Gen IV designs and Molten Salt Reactors being moved forward.

 

[XD-GEM]

Where yat RaleighReloader. I noticed that myth #5 left out what happens once the car is kaput. I know that the auto industry has been working for years to make there standard cars recyclable, at 95% they are very close. Most ev cars use carbon fiber to lighten the load & extend range. Right now carbon fiber is not being recycled. The batteries are still a problem with recycling but they are working on that.
So now let’s look at the environmental impact after the full life & recycling of the cars. After it’s used up you’re going to have a large pile of carbon fiber shards & very large battery in a landfill.

SpaceX will place a mannequin in the used up cars and blast them into space.

https://www.inverse.com/innovation/...ster,world's most powerful operational rocket.

 

[sarky]

Saw this on another site the other day:

Batteries, they do not make electricity – they store electricity produced elsewhere, primarily by coal, uranium, natural gas-powered plants, or diesel-fueled generators. So, to say an EV is a zero-emission vehicle is not at all valid.

Also, since forty percent of the electricity generated in the U.S. is from coal-fired plants, it follows that forty percent of the EVs on the road are coal-powered, do you see?"

But that is not half of it. For those of you excited about electric cars and a green revolution, I want you to take a closer look at batteries and also windmills and solar panels.

A typical EV battery weighs one thousand pounds, about the size of a travel trunk. It contains twenty-five pounds of lithium, sixty pounds of nickel, 44 pounds of manganese, 30 pounds cobalt, 200 pounds of copper, and 400 pounds of aluminum, steel, and plastic. Inside are over 6,000 individual lithium-ion cells.

To manufacture each EV auto battery, you must process 25,000 pounds of brine for the lithium, 30,000 pounds of ore for the cobalt, 5,000 pounds of ore for the nickel, and 25,000 pounds of ore for copper. All told, you dig up 500,000 pounds of the earth's crust for one battery."


The main problem with solar arrays is the chemicals needed to process silicate into the silicon used in the panels. To make pure enough silicon requires processing it with hydrochloric acid, sulfuric acid, nitric acid, hydrogen fluoride, trichloroethane, and acetone. In addition, they also need gallium, arsenide, copper-indium-gallium- diselenide, and cadmium-telluride, which also are highly toxic. Silicon dust is a hazard to the workers, and the panels cannot be recycled.

Windmills are the ultimate in embedded costs and environmental destruction. Each weighs 1688 tons (the equivalent of 23 houses) and contains 1300 tons of concrete, 295 tons of steel, 48 tons of iron, 24 tons of fiberglass, and the hard to extract rare earths neodymium, praseodymium, and dysprosium. Each blade weighs 81,000 pounds and will last 15 to 20 years, at which time it must be replaced. We cannot recycle used blades.

There may be a place for these technologies, but you must look beyond the myth of zero emissions.

"Going Green" may sound like the Utopian ideal but when you look at the hidden and embedded costs realistically with an open mind, you can see that Going Green is more destructive to the Earth's environment than meets the eye, for sure.

I don't know where you got that 40% of electricity comes from coal but it is only 21.6% and going down.

 

[CuradoRoy]

Electric Cars are useful for short commutes.

 

[AdvancedLaser]

Electric Cars are useful for short commutes.

Care to elaborate ?

 

[T-Rigger]

All this hype about ELECTRIC CARS is unmitigated B___S___! ( ... and that's not referring to to Bayou Shooters - too bad the initials are the same...). NO ONE - at least as I am aware, mentions the intended Gummit CONTROL FACTOR!

Has anyone broached the subject of how this - in my opinion - "vehicle from hell" affects one's independence? Consider: its battery's draconian, very limited range and the actual wait time - in line - to actually GET a charge... it's mega expensive finite-lifed battery.,,, how long it takes to get it charged once you FIND a place to do it ... what about aged clunkers in front of you? Do they take longer to charge? The replacement battery's cost is astromomical! Rebuilt replacement batteries - as I've been told - are about 50% of the cost of a new one - with less than 25% of the life expectancy, More "GREEN" puke conveniently unexposed. Control the populace's mobility.

I envision all charging stations anchored to a MOTEL 6 - LIKE operation - with no incentive to quickly send you on your way. Guaranteed nightly 100% occupancy. GOODBYE open road, freedom of flexible vacations, exploration, see the world ... in your own time & at your leisure!

It ain't about "SAVE THE PLANET" ! Russia, China, OPEC - and all our other "friends"= are laughing their rich asses off.

LET'S GO BRANDON!

 

[AdvancedLaser]

All this hype about ELECTRIC CARS is unmitigated B___S___! ( ... and that's not referring to to Bayou Shooters - too bad the initials are the same...). NO ONE - at least as I am aware, mentions the intended Gummit CONTROL FACTOR!

Has anyone broached the subject of how this - in my opinion - "vehicle from hell" affects one's independence? Consider: its battery's draconian, very limited range and the actual wait time - in line - to actually GET a charge... it's mega expensive finite-lifed battery.,,, how long it takes to get it charged once you FIND a place to do it ... what about aged clunkers in front of you? Do they take longer to charge? The replacement battery's cost is astromomical! Rebuilt replacement batteries - as I've been told - are about 50% of the cost of a new one - with less than 25% of the life expectancy, More "GREEN" puke conveniently unexposed. Control the populace's mobility.

I envision all charging stations anchored to a MOTEL 6 - LIKE operation - with no incentive to quickly send you on your way. Guaranteed nightly 100% occupancy. GOODBYE open road, freedom of flexible vacations, exploration, see the world ... in your own time & at your leisure!

It ain't about "SAVE THE PLANET" ! Russia, China, OPEC - and all our other "friends"= are laughing their rich asses off.

LET'S GO BRANDON!

Even the smallest bit of research might help you sound educated about the matter.

Its "draconian" battery will do on average 320 miles on a charge. Same as most ICE vehicles.

The wait time at a Supercharger is between 15-35 min. Enough time to get food and pee.

Superchargers cover 99% of the US population and there are over 1,300 of them so you can travel coast to coast. Takes on average 4-5 hours to charge at home or a hotel destination charger.

The replacement battery is in the realm of $11,000. Im curious the cost of a new engine on some of the new ICE vehicles.

No one makes a replacement battery yet. Where did you get the data that they sell replacement ones and they have 25% of the life in them ?

Be mad at the tech, yes, but dont just throw out statements as if they are facts, so that the rest of the uninformed can believe and parrot.

 

[Xeon64]

I drove a 1998 Ford Ranger for almost 20 years and it had over 300,000 miles on it when I sold it. Before that it was a 1984 Dodge Ram Prospector that had 375,000 miles on it. I want to see an electric Car do that.

 

[gunz4me]

I wonder how California is going to upgrade their electrical infrastructure in time for the pending ban on ICE vehicles being sold in the up and coming years? FFS, they can't even make it through summer as it currently stands without performing rolling blackouts. What is going to happen when everyone has electric cars?

 

[AdvancedLaser]

I drove a 1998 Ford Ranger for almost 20 years and it had over 300,000 miles on it when I sold it. Before that it was a 1984 Dodge Ram Prospector that had 375,000 miles on it. I want to see an electric Car do that.

There is currently a Tesla about to hit 750,000 miles.
Hes been thru 4 motors and three batteries to get there. First motor and battery were warranty.

 

[KDerekT83]

My 1988 Honda Civic has 603k on the chasis, and only on it's second engine that I installed about a yr ago. I cannot vouch for how well/badly it was treated before me. Only thing I can verify is that it was the original engine/trans for the car. (Honda VIN stamps their drivetrains). From what I'm seeing/reading, Tesla was likely on it's "4th motor" most likely, by the time it hit that mileage.

 

[RaleighReloader]

I owned a 1990 Volkswagen Golf Diesel that had well over 400,000 miles on the clock when it was finally retired. The drivetrain still worked fine and probably would have lasted a lot longer; the rest of the body had begun to corrode heavily and wasn't worth repairing.

I did a bit of googling and read about a Tesla in Germany that has almost a million miles on the clock. No, it doesn't have its original drivetrain, but I'm not sure any passenger car drivetrain would last that long.

I also have concerns about the current crop of turbocharged small displacement engines that have become so popular lately. I'm thinking that in a few years, there will be a lot of used cars with leaking turbochargers—and those won't be cheap to fix. Heaven knows the average idiot consumer isn't going to be fastidious about maintenance, and those little engines are going to be much easier to burn out than their larger displacement, slower turning brethren.

Mike

 

[puritanize]

This is what you do when the bill comes in to repair the battery.


To me, once again in a battle for the EV market, they rush a ton of tech out without thinking of the repercussions, for example recycling the batteries.

 

[AdvancedLaser]

I owned a 1990 Volkswagen Golf Diesel that had well over 400,000 miles on the clock when it was finally retired. The drivetrain still worked fine and probably would have lasted a lot longer; the rest of the body had begun to corrode heavily and wasn't worth repairing.

I did a bit of googling and read about a Tesla in Germany that has almost a million miles on the clock. No, it doesn't have its original drivetrain, but I'm not sure any passenger car drivetrain would last that long.

I also have concerns about the current crop of turbocharged small displacement engines that have become so popular lately. I'm thinking that in a few years, there will be a lot of used cars with leaking turbochargers—and those won't be cheap to fix. Heaven knows the average idiot consumer isn't going to be fastidious about maintenance, and those little engines are going to be much easier to burn out than their larger displacement, slower turning brethren.

Mike

Thats the same one. Its a million kilometers. 650k miles.

 

[AdvancedLaser]

This is what you do when the bill comes in to repair the battery.


To me, once again in a battle for the EV market, they rush a ton of tech out without thinking of the repercussions, for example recycling the batteries.

Research Redwood Materials and JB Straubel. He left Tesla specifically to open a company dedicated to recycling batteries. When they recycle the Cobalt from them, which is one of the biggest materials in the current gen batteries, the recycled materials cant be distinguished from the raw mined materials.

 

[Abby Normal]

The largest problem with the ev is the govmint propaganda on how Great they are, regulations & subsidies but having huge drawbacks they will never admit to. Elon Musk even said that we do not have the infrastructure to go all electric but don’t tell that to the politicians. In cali they don’t want new power lines or plant but everyone must drive electric cars! I guess you heard of a supply chain problem on the west coast partly blamed on lack of truck drivers. Guess what cali ports just did. All trucks entering the port Must Be Electric!
Are there enough ev big rigs, charging stations, power lines, ect to support the ports in cali.
So the politicos/regulators in cali just made this supply problem worse & long lasting.
How about letting the market place decide which is better, cheaper not the govt regulators.
All of those regulations & upheaval to save the plant in 12, 10, no 7 yrs. Hurry up before we find out what going on!

 

[T-Rigger]

Even the smallest bit of research might help you sound educated about the matter.

Its "draconian" battery will do on average 320 miles on a charge. Same as most ICE vehicles.

The wait time at a Supercharger is between 15-35 min. Enough time to get food and pee.

Superchargers cover 99% of the US population and there are over 1,300 of them so you can travel coast to coast. Takes on average 4-5 hours to charge at home or a hotel destination charger.

The replacement battery is in the realm of $11,000. Im curious the cost of a new engine on some of the new ICE vehicles.

No one makes a replacement battery yet. Where did you get the data that they sell replacement ones and they have 25% of the life in them ?

Be mad at the tech, yes, but dont just throw out statements as if they are facts, so that the rest of the uninformed can believe and parrot.

Thank you for your response - from an apparently knowledgeable advocate of this wonderous new tech. From your icon, I gather, perhaps erroneously, that you are invested in this industry. I usually don't receive or when prompted, respond to negative posts... but...

WOW! 320 miles range! I can't remember being stuck at an interstate or even STATE hwy gasoline infusion facility for more than 5-10 minutes. - including a pee & a snack. According to multiple internet sources, there is about 47,800 miles of Interstate Hwys in the US. 47,800 dvided by 1,300 = 1 per 37 miles. Impressive -somewhat dispersed, but not evenly distrbuted about the Interstate system.

1300 charging stations in the contiguous USA? According to multiple internet sources, there is, per 2019 data, about 4.17 million miles of US hwys. 4.7 mil divided by 1300 = 36.153 miles. - not counting STATE & COUNTY ROADS. Wow! My bladder ain't that big! Statistics can be used to support any position.

FYI - I have done a wee bit of research and my comments were based on the real-time experience of one of my clients. She is almost bankrupt from her licensed taxi company - started with a (past) fleet of newly-purchased Toyota Prius's (proper plural spelling?).

The replacement cost of the new warrantied battery's actual longevity was not researched before purchase (sadly). Nor was it mentioned in negotiations for the initial multiple acquisitions. When failures began she had very bad experience with "reconditioned" (whatever... replacements, etc). The last remnant of the now-disposed-of-fleet was then being driven by her daugther . It was fraught with reliability issues - no specific issues discussed. ?? Dump it at an additional loss of capital - or - per diagnosed need of a new battery, throw good money after bad by purchasing a reconditioned battery for tempory relief, or eat the higher cost of a new battery?

Again, granted, " ...buyer beware...". BUT.. where is the responsibility of the industry (& the U S gumit & its multi-monion consumer "protective" agencies) to advise &/or fully disclose?

Granted, I know nothing of the difference between older "hybrids" and the "new all-elec" vehicles... don't care. I also, do not understand the new "ICE" (internal combustion engines either ( along with other DIY old farts like me). I own, drive, & work on older "ICE" vehicles, to the extent that I can, with old tools and learning purchased new scanners.

I well remember a decades-old Christmas Eve breakdown, driving a-then-near-new, "ICE" Ford van - along w/ a distraugt wife & 5 distressed kids - & hidden Santa presents. Headed for Grandpa & Grandma's house. Stranded in Hazelhurst, MS. Towed to a grease-monkey road side shop. Asked a few questions by a very young mechanic in greasy overalls, having obviously imbibed a few Xmas spirits. Then, miraculously, about 20 minutes later, being thankfully on our way - $25 (plus generous tip). Fancy that today... on Xmas Eve? How much to even turn the scanner on ... if one would?

Multple sites offer reconditioned/rebuilt batteries. Sorry I don't understand the nuances of this esoteric terminolgy. ... rebuilt, reconditioned, repurposed ... whatever buzzwords. Believe their hype ? One such example ...

https://www.thehybridshop.com/battery-conditioning

I'm NOT interested in NEW ICE engine tech. The gumit has f'd that too. I had a salvaged junk yard engine installed in a Toyota Camry a few years ago - still running. Wife & kids never checked the Jiffy Lube oil leak from the filter. Total cost - $800.

Put up with the control as you will. The post was about the CONTROL - NOT the TECH - (of which I am admittedly under-informed) - just sayin'.

Your In-Put-Down-Acknowledged ... ignoring allegations of my total (almost) ignorance. No avarice intended toward your esoteric (& all such other tech) industries' vested interests. Tech is the future. We're not ALL as unreceptive as you think - just skeptical.

Noone is always right. Consider others' vtew points.

 

[Forgotten]

Wind powered car options.