(UPDATED APRIL 2024) Sale of Braced AR Pistols on BayouShooter

[AustinBR]

April 2024 Update:
***Please read the entire notice to help avoid any confusion.***
Due to the current status of the pistol brace rule and with the belief the status will not change soon, the site has decided to allow braced pistols to be listed again. There are a couple of caveats:
-Any past warnings for pistol braces will stand as they were violations at the time they were issued.
-Any current listings should be edited or bumped to include the brace if desired. Duplicate ads should not be posted for the purpose of including a brace with the pistol. If you are unable to edit the original ad, report the ad and wait for guidance before reposting the item in a duplicate ad.

Original Message:
Hi Everyone,

After the public discussion this week following numerous reported posts, we have decided to prohibit the sale of braced, unregistered SBRs (AR Pistols) on the forum. While we do not agree with the ATF ruling in any way and hope it is quickly repealed, we have always asked that all site users follow all applicable laws in their jurisdiction whenever utilizing the forum. Under the ATF ruling, it is currently illegal for FFLs to sell braced rifles with barrels shorter than 16", unless registered as an NFA item. In the near future, it will be illegal to possess a braced AR pistol that is not registered as an NFA item. As such, effective immediately, we will ask that users do not post or attempt to buy/sell unregistered, braced AR pistols on the forum.

We will not be doing any form of lookback or removing AR pistol posts that have been listed over the past years as there are simply too many, most of which are likely not for sale anymore.

Going forward, we will prohibit the posting or the bumping (replying to) of ads for braced AR pistols*. This is effective immediately.

If you have a braced AR pistol that you would like to sell, we encourage you to follow one of two paths:
1) Remove the brace. Make a for-sale (WTS or WTT) post for the brace. Separately, make an additional for-sale post for the AR Pistol. We will not allow posts that contain both items.
*2) Register the braced AR Pistol as an NFA item. You may then post that it is an NFA item for sale and then you must follow all applicable laws to do so. If we suspect that an account is attempting to illegally sell NFA items, we will follow the typical procedure of removing the post and the account, as we have for many years.

Again, I know no one agrees with the ATF decision. We certainly do not. But, as it stands it is the law and we intend to follow it on the forum.

If you have any questions or comments, please feel free to discuss below.

Thanks,
Austin

 

[Xenon]

I don't have a horse (ad) in the race, but I suggest clarification on the stance of WTT posts in addition to the WTS

 

[AustinBR]

I don't have a horse (ad) in the race, but I suggest clarification on the stance of WTT posts in addition to the WTS

Updated.

 

[freedive10]

Lord help our Country!

 

[Magdump]

I might be in the market for a good SB tactical brace on the cheap. Epstein did not kill himsrlf. Shall not be infringed.

 

[AustinBR]

I might be in the market for a good SB tactical brace on the cheap. Epstein did not kill himsrlf. Shall not be infringed.

I'm sure you'll be able to find a bunch of them in the coming months for pennies on the dollar.

 

[whbonney26]

I'm sure you'll be able to find a bunch of them in the coming months for pennies on the dollar.

But, the braces are not illegal are they? Say.....if they are on a rifle with a 16" barrel.

The braces are not what is being registered to my understanding. You are filling out a Form1 on whatever its on. In my case I would be making a SBR of the AR. Not the brace.

 

[thperez1972]

But, the braces are not illegal are they? Say.....if they are on a rifle with a 16" barrel.

The braces are not what is being registered to my understanding. You are filling out a Form1 on whatever its on. In my case I would be making a SBR of the AR. Not the brace.

The ATF sees the brace as a stock in some instances and as a brace in other instances. You are correct, the weapon is being registered, not the brace. Replacing a <16* barrel with a 16* or greater barrel is one of the ATF's options for a fix.

In your case, the final ruling made it such that there was no difference between your weapon with the brace and your weapon with a stock. The same restrictions for transferring your weapon with a stock would apply to your weapon with the brace.

 

[BIGGREEN]

I sure miss my braced shorty...lost it in a damn boating incident, hangin with Stalecracker...LOL

 

[EightySix]

That's very anti-2A of you, thanks.

 

[AustinBR]

But, the braces are not illegal are they? Say.....if they are on a rifle with a 16" barrel.

The braces are not what is being registered to my understanding. You are filling out a Form1 on whatever its on. In my case I would be making a SBR of the AR. Not the brace.

While they are not illegal, most people had braces for the purpose of exploiting the loophole to get a SBR without going the NFA route. I'm speculating that there will be a bunch on the market for cheap if people decide to remove the brace from their firearm.

That's very anti-2A of you, thanks.

Not at all. We've always followed the law here because we don't want to be accused of supporting criminal activities. As it stands, braced AR pistols with sub 16" barrels are becoming illegal.

Getting the site shut down or having our site staff be part of a criminal investigation doesn't help the shooting community.

The way to protest this overreach by the ATF is in the courtroom with lawyers, not on a forum.

 

[southerncanuck]

That's very anti-2A of you, thanks.

Respectfully, it might be worth re-reading both the constitution and the ATF ruling. You don't seem intimately familiar with either.

You should be more respectful to the guys that keep this site running. These guys are (I think) volunteers that put up with a lot of our BS for the sake of keeping a community running, so us losers can have a place to trade bang-bang toys and talk ****.

 

[Magdump]

Exploiting loopholes? Like exploiting the gun show loophole to sell my private property? Oh boy. I’m amazed, if not disheartened at how people, supposedly of like minds, can have such opposing views on the same subject when we’re all in the same boat. Too many different generations maybe? It’s just sad. Sad to be so divided even on simple terms about a right that’s so important. The one that has its own SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED clause. I guess I must be more naive that I thought. I just can’t understand how we’re not all automatically on the same page when it comes to our 2nd amendment rights. I guess after my generation dies off the rest will just cave and the US will reach disarmed status. I guess I won’t care so much then, but I know my kids will.

Yeah, I’ll buy a few braces if I see them cheap. Put them in the closet in case this BS goes the way of the bump stock.

 

[GunRelated]

It's almost like we were exploiting loopholes this whole time. Good thing we had presidents like Reagan, that "conservatives" seem to adore so much. At least he made sure to close a lot of the loopholes, keeping America safe from those evil machine guns. And Trump, let's not forget about daddy Trump closing that bumpstock loophole.

Some of y'all should move to the UK, you'd fit in real well over there.

 

[noob]

I'm ok with this. Though I love guns, and own a bunch, I don't expect a business to want to tread murky waters and possibly have legal issues on their hand. It's not like they make a ton of money, but this site allows many like minded individuals to have conversation and a place to sell guns. And unlike places like LAsportsman, it's not full of felons looking to buy guns illegally. I'm a pharmacist by trade, and if the State law says I cannot sell abortion medication, I won't sell it as I'm not going to risk losing my business. That's another big debate with liberals saying it's FDA approved (but not understanding that's a safety recommendation and not law), and state can be more strict that federal guidelines. But why would I directly defy the Board that issues my license as I wouldn't be able to practice without it.

 

[machinedrummer]

I find the term loopholes offensive and racist. It makes me think of a noose and I get triggered. Hmm…even triggered offends me. Ban them both!

 

[Griz375]

But, the braces are not illegal are they? Say.....if they are on a rifle with a 16" barrel.

The braces are not what is being registered to my understanding. You are filling out a Form1 on whatever its on. In my case I would be making a SBR of the AR. Not the brace.

The real issue I see (might be wrong) is filling out forms being submitted by a Federal Agency controlled by a Anti 2A/anything that goes bang Administration.

Completing such a form identifies you, where you live and the fact you own firearms. In other words, a preliminary road map/shopping list of what to look for and seize.

Similar to why the Feds want to track PM sales.

Call me a paranoid sceptic if you want.

 

[whbonney26]

The real issue I see (might be wrong) is filling out forms being submitted by a Federal Agency controlled by a Anti 2A/anything that goes bang Administration.

Completing such a form identifies you, where you live and the fact you own firearms. In other words, a preliminary road map/shopping list of what to look for and seize.

Similar to why the Feds want to track PM sales.

Call me a paranoid sceptic if you want.

I get that but we already had to registure NFA items such as machine guns, sbr and suppressors so this part of it is nothing new. Of course I would think most of us here would rather not have to reg. anything to use it but those laws have already been on the books for a while.

 

[noob]

The real issue I see (might be wrong) is filling out forms being submitted by a Federal Agency controlled by a Anti 2A/anything that goes bang Administration.

Completing such a form identifies you, where you live and the fact you own firearms. In other words, a preliminary road map/shopping list of what to look for and seize.

Similar to why the Feds want to track PM sales.

Call me a paranoid sceptic if you want.

As a guy with a dozen SBR's and probably 9 suppressors. I don't see an issue being on a "list" as I've been on it for 15 years and haven't had a knock on my door yet.

 

[AustinBR]

Exploiting loopholes? Like exploiting the gun show loophole to sell my private property? Oh boy. I’m amazed, if not disheartened at how people, supposedly of like minds, can have such opposing views on the same subject when we’re all in the same boat. Too many different generations maybe? It’s just sad. Sad to be so divided even on simple terms about a right that’s so important. The one that has its own SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED clause. I guess I must be more naive that I thought. I just can’t understand how we’re not all automatically on the same page when it comes to our 2nd amendment rights. I guess after my generation dies off the rest will just cave and the US will reach disarmed status. I guess I won’t care so much then, but I know my kids will.

Yeah, I’ll buy a few braces if I see them cheap. Put them in the closet in case this BS goes the way of the bump stock.

It's almost like we were exploiting loopholes this whole time. Good thing we had presidents like Reagan, that "conservatives" seem to adore so much. At least he made sure to close a lot of the loopholes, keeping America safe from those evil machine guns. And Trump, let's not forget about daddy Trump closing that bumpstock loophole.

Some of y'all should move to the UK, you'd fit in real well over there.

You two are something else.

We can argue that the 2A has been "infringed" by plenty of laws that have stood the test of time and multiple courts, including the supreme court. There are also many gun laws that 2A supporters support. An easy one is violent felons not having access to firearms.

Years ago, laws were passed that made rifles with <16" barrels classified as "short-barreled rifles." Folks found a loophole by attaching a brace to them and calling them a "braced pistol"...that just so happens to shoot a rifle round. The writing was on the wall that it would be classified as a SBR at some point. So yes, I'll call it a loophole because an AR with a 12 inch barrel is not a pistol.

I've also mentioned that I think the NFA laws are pretty dumb. Suppressors and SBRs should be much easier to get for the everyday responsible gun owner. But they're not. Maybe go protest that instead of wasting your time telling other clear supporters of the 2A and general firearm rights to "move to the UK."