And the Rich get Richer!

[Charles1959]

I never really had a problem with the "Rich get Richer" scenario. But if this little video is even close to accurate then it's a good example of 'there ought to be a better way'. I know the wealthy create business and jobs. I know capitalism works and drives economies. I know we have the best system around. But Damn... I didn't know the disparity.

http://www.upworthy.com/9-out-of-10-americans-are-completely-wrong-about-this-mind-blowing-fact-2

 

[Ferrara Fire]

It would be interesting to know how many of those 1% are politicians and Federal Employee's...

 

[Fred_G]

How many are included that invested in a bidness, and lost their arse? And how many of our 'poor' have cell phones and cable TV? And, as posted above, what all do our congress critters make above and beyond their salary?

When I think of poor, I think of children in Africa, too weak to brush the flies of their face. Here, poor is when your cable gets cut off, and your Bush cell phone is out of minutes so you can't call and bitch. (it ain't actually an Obamaphone...)

 

[dcmann]

So, what solutions do we have?

1)Tax it from them? No, they will just leave, because they could afford go anywhere (and probably already got a lot stashed away).
2) Stop buying their silicon valley stuff, going to their movies, buying their medical treatments, or shopping at their stores? No, I like my iPad too much, World war Z wasn't that bad, If I get sick I'm going to get fixed up, and Walmart(or other stores) are nice though I am shopping local more.

So, my solution? Level the heck out of the playing field by deregulation, lower tax rates across the board, repeal Obamacare, shrink the size of government, take away safety nets (longterm unemployment, welfare, etc...)and let people work as hard as they want to work for the life style they want.

You wanna be rich? Work your tail off. Even a lawn man can create an empire with hard work and government out of his way. Me? I don't need to be rich, I just like the freedom to try, if I want.

 

[Fred_G]

So, what solutions do we have?

1)Tax it from them? No, they will just leave, because they could afford go anywhere (and probably already got a lot stashed away).
2) Stop buying their silicon valley stuff, going to their movies, buying their medical treatments, or shopping at their stores? No, I like my iPad too much, World war Z wasn't that bad, If I get sick I'm going to get fixed up, and Walmart(or other stores) are nice though I am shopping local more.

So, my solution? Level the heck out of the playing field by deregulation, lower tax rates across the board, repeal Obamacare, shrink the size of government, take away safety nets (longterm unemployment, welfare, etc...)and let people work as hard as they want to work for the life style they want.

You wanna be rich? Work your tail off. Even a lawn man can create an empire with hard work and government out of his way. Me? I don't need to be rich, I just like the freedom to try, if I want.

Have the black helicopters picked you up yet? Amen brother!

 

[Hogin]

So, what solutions do we have?

So, my solution? Level the heck out of the playing field by deregulation, lower tax rates across the board, repeal Obamacare, shrink the size of government, take away safety nets (longterm unemployment, welfare, etc...)and let people work as hard as they want to work for the life style they want.

You wanna be rich? Work your tail off. Even a lawn man can create an empire with hard work and government out of his way. Me? I don't need to be rich, I just like the freedom to try, if I want.

Plus 2 on dcmann's solutions. I agree 100%. Please keep me informed when you plan on running for office, you have my vote!

 

[bhart89]

America, where the poor are more likely to be obese and have more cable channels than Bill Gates did when he was 18.

 

[tim9lives]

Plus 2 on dcmann's solutions. I agree 100%. Please keep me informed when you plan on running for office, you have my vote!

The solution is a fairly simple solution.....a solution which was passed by our government back in the 30s and 40s.
It is called the inheritance tax. Or...as some want to call it...the death tax. I think it used to be a 50% tax when someone died if their estate was worth over a million dollars. In 1950...a million bucks was a lot of money.

The only reason anyone in America becomes super wealthy is because this country has the best infrastructure in the world and we have the most efficient financial structure in the world. The reason Microsoft and Apple became so big is because they had access to Wall Street....Wall Street issued stock and those companies had the capital to build a great business. The internet worked great in America because back in the day...we had AT&T which had a great phone system which allowed us to hook up that 1200 baud modem. And we wanted more bandwith...and other companies stepped up to the plate. Kids in garages built computers in silicon valley....they fed off of each other.
Its the Universities...electrical grid...roads...ports...shipping....police and security which makes this country great. Its the great health care and schools which draw people here. And all of that....from the top to the bottom....including the garbage man who makes sure we don't have trash piling up in the streets which make America great.
And all of the above cost money to build and maintain. That is why we pay taxes. You don't want taxes...move to Mexico. But beware of the gangs which kidnap your children and the corrupt Federales who are getting a cut of the ransom.
And FWIW...that is why the Waltons and the other super rich will NOT MOVE. They like to sleep well at night...and know their family is safe.

And anybody who rises from the bottom to the top needs to recognize that they owe a debt to our system of government in the form of taxes. Yes...we all hate taxes. Yet those taxes are what pays for our security...including our military. Over 20% of our budget goes towards our military expenses. And that military is what ensures the free trade shipping lines across the world.

So even though many people think just because they worked their asses off...they deserve to keep that wealth.....I say Bull ****. They should not be able to die...and leave 100%...or even 80% of their wealth to their heirs. They owe a debt back to the country.

I think Warren Buffet and Bill Gates kind of get that idea. But a lot of other people don't get it. And I'm not saying if your estate is worth 5 million...or even 25 million...that you should have to pay a 50% tax. But when someone is worth a BILLION DOLLARS....then yes...they should have to pay 500,000,000.00 in taxes. The family heirs get the other 500 million.

The the simple fact of the matter is that the super wealthy....the top 1% have way too much wealth. We had a pretty good inheritance tax years ago. Basically...if a person was a millionaire back in the 1920s and 30s...when they died...the heirs had to pay 50% in taxes to the Federal Government.

The Walton Family heirs are a prime example of a family with too much wealth. They didn't do it on their own. Their father is the one who did it. And he built an empire because he was at the right place...at the right time....with the right idea....IN THE RIGHT COUNTRY----THE USA.

Collectively, the Waltons own over 50% of the company, and are worth a combined total of $150 billion (as of August 2013).[2] In 2010, six members of the Walton family had the same net worth as either the bottom 28% or 41% of American families combined (depending on how it is counted).[3]

That family does owe a lot to the US government IMO. They can afford to pay a 50% death tax....and after paying that tax....they will be just fine. None of them will suffer one bit.

Lowering taxes on a person or family who has over 5 billion dollars in wealth is a perfect recipe for creating a super rich elite class with way too much power. Money is Power. And with 25 billion dollars...you can buy each and every politician in America.

By the way...even though we had a 50% inheritance tax for over 75 years....I don't think you'll find many poor Kennedys...Fords...Firestones...etc. They still left millions to their heirs.

 

[Fred_G]

And anybody who rises from the bottom to the top needs to recognize that they owe a debt to our system of government in the form of taxes. Yes...we all hate taxes. Yet those taxes are what pays for our security...including our military. Over 20% of our budget goes towards our military expenses. And that military is what ensures the free trade shipping lines across the world.

So even though many people think just because they worked their asses off...they deserve to keep that wealth.....I say Bull ****. They should not be able to die...and leave 100%...or even 80% of their wealth to their heirs. They owe a debt back to the country.

I think Warren Buffet and Bill Gates kind of get that idea. But a lot of other people don't get it. And I'm not saying if your estate is worth 5 million...or even 25 million...that you should have to pay a 50% tax. But when someone is worth a BILLION DOLLARS....then yes...they should have to pay 500,000,000.00 in taxes. The family heirs get the other 500 million.

So, they pay taxes on money they earn, then need to pay half of it again after they die? You do realize about half of the people in the US don't pay federal taxes right? And the top percent of earners pay most of the taxes.

You don't 'owe a debt to society' for being successful. Most successful people employ a lot of people. I would go on, but don't think it is worth mine or your time.

 

[Neil09]

Wow.

 

[tim9lives]

So, they pay taxes on money they earn, then need to pay half of it again after they die? You do realize about half of the people in the US don't pay federal taxes right? And the top percent of earners pay most of the taxes.

You don't 'owe a debt to society' for being successful. Most successful people employ a lot of people. I would go on, but don't think it is worth mine or your time.

The only reason anyone makes it in America is because of the Infrastructure of this country. And its all connected. Its the Law enforcement...fire protection...electrical grid...roads...highways...hospitals...trains..airlines..etc. And everyone one of those things do depend on Federal subsidies and tax breaks.

Do you think you can easily work hard and become a millionaire...or billionaire in India...Mexico..or China? NO...it takes a lot more than hard work to make it in third world countries. To make it there.. One is related to the leadership in those countries.

A person has a chance in America because of the TOTAL system. And all of that...takes money. We have the most powerful Military in the world. That military is paid for by taxes. Something like 20 to 25% of our national expense is for our military alone. But take away the military...and I guarantee that the dollar would crash and the USA would end up like the Soviet Union.

But back to my main point of the accumulation of wealth. Inheritance taxes are needed to prevent dynasty families. If it were not for the taxes and regulation in the 1920's and 30s...America would most likely be a stagnant country run by the Kennedys....Fords...Rockefellers...Firestones...Edison...etc. Those families would have retained all of their wealth....and slowly but surely bought out each and every competitor. They would have prevented the dynamic growth in this country.
And its a dangerous thing for a family to have that much wealth.

Because the sad truth of the matter is that in most families....Once the driven person who built the empire dies...their children tend to be greedy and lazy. They do not become forward thinkers...because they want to maintain their grip on power.

If the Robber Barron Railroad men of the 1920s had their way...they would have prevented the building of the Interstate Highway system. And that is exactly what happens in many third world nations where certain families hold all of the power and money.

It is not that they want to only hold their money and power...they want to keep everyone else down. And they use their money to destroy the competition. A prime example is Ma Bell. The break up of Ma Bell is what led to the computer revolution and the Internet. But if ATT still had their way...we would not have the internet...cell phones....etc.
We'd probably still have rotary phones.

 

[kz45]

Daaaaamn!! Am I dreaming ?

 

[Fred_G]

It is not that they want to only hold their money and power...they want to keep everyone else down. And they use their money to destroy the competition. A prime example is Ma Bell. The break up of Ma Bell is what led to the computer revolution and the Internet. But if ATT still had their way...we would not have the internet...cell phones....etc.
We'd probably still have rotary phones.

Let me see if I am getting this straight. The rich want to keep the poor down, so they can make more more money off the people who don't have any money. Hmm... yes, make money off those who don't have any. Good plan.

Shall we compare and contrast the contributions to society between a person who invests their money into a bidness, makes money and passes this money onto their children vs the contributions of a family that lives in subsidized housing and gets subsidized food and a free Bush cell phone? Dang 1%'ers! Tax 'em more!

Here is some reading I highly recommend to you: http://econfaculty.gmu.edu/wew/articles.html

 

[enutees]

I think never in history have people bitched so much about what others have. Most of us on here are probably at least middle class. I'm willing to bet most of you have a car, a safe house with a/c and heat, means to protect yourself, clothes, and enough to eat. Do you have everything you want? probably not. It is a small portion of history where almost everyone (at least in America) has enough. Who cares if you drive a hyundai and the rich guy has a yacht and ferraris. The difference is small. Think about how different your parents or grandparents lived depending on your age.

Just my thoughts.

 

[tim9lives]

Let me see if I am getting this straight. The rich want to keep the poor down, so they can make more more money off the people who don't have any money. Hmm... yes, make money off those who don't have any. Good plan.

Shall we compare and contrast the contributions to society between a person who invests their money into a bidness, makes money and passes this money onto their children vs the contributions of a family that lives in subsidized housing and gets subsidized food and a free Bush cell phone? Dang 1%'ers! Tax 'em more!

No...I did not say that all rich people want to keep the poor down. What I said is that when you look at many other nations...you have families which have held on to power and controlled the government.
And SOME BUSINESSES do want to stomp the competition. There is such a thing as being too big and too powerful. Give the Walton family another 20 years....maybe they will then own 65% or 75% of the wealth in America. Where does it end? 85%....90%....

Also...look at history....with Standard Oil. John D Rockefeller was ruthless.
Standard’s most potent weapons against competitors were underselling, differential pricing, and secret transportation rebates.[36] The firm was attacked by journalists and politicians throughout its existence, in part for these monopolistic methods, giving momentum to the antitrust movement. By 1880, according to the New York World, Standard Oil was "the most cruel, impudent, pitiless, and grasping monopoly that ever fastened upon a country."[37]

Standard Oil had gained an aura of invincibility, always prevailing against competitors, critics, and political enemies. It had become the richest, biggest, most feared business in the world, seemingly immune to the boom and bust of the business cycle, consistently racking up profits year after year.[39]

 

[tim9lives]

I think never in history have people bitched so much about what others have. Most of us on here are probably at least middle class. I'm willing to bet most of you have a car, a safe house with a/c and heat, means to protect yourself, clothes, and enough to eat. Do you have everything you want? probably not. It is a small portion of history where almost everyone (at least in America) has enough. Who cares if you drive a hyundai and the rich guy has a yacht and ferraris. The difference is small. Think about how different your parents or grandparents lived depending on your age.

Just my thoughts.

I could care less about cars and such. I'm talking about powerful families which become dynasties. It dangerous. They tend to control the government....get preferential treatment...get drunk....drive cars over bridges killing girls...and walk. And that's just one example.

Furthermore...Those who benefit the most in this country and become Bill Gates or Steve Jobs...Or Walmart do owe a debt to the country. Walmart could never have built that Empire in any other country. Only in America.

Walmart is a direct beneficiary of our Tax system....Food Stamps....Interstate system...electrical grid...etc.
When its time to pay for those things which make this country great...do you really think a family which already earned 25% of this countries wealth....should continue to benefit from our infrastructure...and our food stamp and welfare system.....and not have to pay to maintain this countries infrastructure. If they aren't taxed...who is going to pay for it. YOU ? Me ?

It ain't going to be the person who has nothing who is getting Medicaid and food stamps. So who should pay ?

 

[Fred_G]

It had become the richest, biggest, most feared business in the world, seemingly immune to the boom and bust of the business cycle, consistently racking up profits year after year.[39]

Sounds more like the gubment to me. What other bidness can spend hundreds of millions of dollars on a website, that does not work, and rack up $17 trillion dollars in debt? Gimmie some rich tycoon type any day over confiscatory taxes and wealth redistribution.

 

[hdfinder47]

Sounds more like the gubment to me. What other bidness can spend hundreds of millions of dollars on a website, that does not work, and rack up $17 trillion dollars in debt? Gimmie some rich tycoon type any day over confiscatory taxes and wealth redistribution.

yup.

 

[swagge1]

What is the criteria to being considered a 1%er?

 

[Fred_G]

What is the criteria to being considered a 1%er?

Make more than the average liberal?