Brandished firearm escalated argument ?; CHP holder arrested

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  • Speedlace

    LOL...right?
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    Jan 23, 2007
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    Bus driver charged with manslaughter in fatal shooting on Valrico basketball court

    TAMPA — After two days of public outcry, Hillsborough County deputies arrested a 69-year-old man Tuesday on a manslaughter charge in the fatal shooting of an Air Force veteran on a Valrico basketball court.

    School bus driver Trevor Dooley was led in handcuffs from his home on Partridge Point Trail and booked into the Hillsborough County jail.

    Sheriff's deputies say he shot David James, 41, who had been playing basketball with his 8-year-old daughter Sunday afternoon. The confrontation started over a teenage boy skateboarding on the neighborhood court.

    Dooley, who is not cooperating with authorities and has made no statement about the incident, also faces charges of improper exhibition of a firearm and openly carrying a firearm, the Sheriff's Office said.

    Kanina James, widow of the victim, said she was pleased by the arrest but said the manslaughter charge is inadequate.

    "I want it to be first-degree murder," she said.

    The Hillsborough State Attorney's Office ultimately determines what charges will be filed, and spokesman Mark Cox said he couldn't discuss the decision.

    Dooley could face up to 30 years in prison if convicted of manslaughter.

    At about 3:45 p.m. Sunday, as James played basketball with his daughter, a 14-year-old boy asked him if it was okay to skateboard on the court. James told him that was fine.

    Dooley, who apparently had been watching the exchange from inside his home across the street, marched outside with a gun in his waistband to demand that the skateboarder get off the court, the Sheriff's Office said.

    James defended the boy, so Dooley started arguing with him. Dooley turned to walk away, and that's when James yelled after him, questioning him about the gun sticking out of his pants, the Sheriff's Office said.

    Dooley turned back and pulled out the gun, deputies said.

    James lunged toward Dooley in an apparent attempt to disarm him and they struggled, falling to the ground. The gun fired, striking James in the chest.

    "The suspect fired the gun," said Chief Deputy Jose Docobo. "There's no indication the victim pulled the trigger."

    He didn't say if detectives believe Dooley intentionally fired.

    Before the struggle for the weapon, there was no physical confrontation, Docobo said, clarifying the agency's position that the shooting would not be defensible under Florida's "Stand Your Ground" law.

    In fact, it appears James was defending himself — not the other way around, Docobo said.

    "The victim wasn't armed. There was no indication he was armed," Docobo said. "It's apparent from the interviews that he was at least trying to defend himself, if not trying to disarm Mr. Dooley at the same time."

    Investigators found a pocket knife at the scene, but deputies don't believe it belonged to James. They're not sure how it got there, Docobo said.

    Although the killing happened Sunday, and investigators tried to talk with Dooley that night, the first time the Sheriff's Office named him as the suspect was Tuesday.

    It was a tough investigation, deputies have said, because witness accounts varied and Dooley wouldn't speak to investigators.

    He immediately invoked his right to remain silent and got an attorney — Ronald Tulin, his neighbor a few cul-de-sacs down in the Twin Lakes subdivision, which is south of State Road 60.

    Tulin said Tuesday he wasn't ready to comment.

    Authorities said they had been investigating who pulled the trigger and whether the shooting was justified.

    On Monday, they interviewed the 8-year-old girl who had seen her father get shot. They also spoke with a witness who was playing tennis nearby.

    James' wife, and other neighbors, couldn't understand why Dooley wasn't arrested right away. Docobo said he understands why people might have been upset.

    "From an emotional standpoint, it's difficult to understand why someone who brings a gun to a park and shoots and kills someone isn't arrested," Docobo said. "We have to let cool heads prevail and not let emotions cloud our judgment."

    Jay Lovelace, who was David James' commander while he served in Iraq and had come to help out the family, said Tuesday the couple's daughter has been crying, unable to sleep and asking about the shooting.

    On the way to a McDonald's, they had passed a basketball court. "That's a basketball court like the one where my daddy was shot," he recalled she had said.

    Several neighbors said they hope Tuesday's arrest will bring some peace back to the neighborhood.

    "A firearm should have never been brought out," said neighbor George Carroll, 38. "Bringing a pistol to scare the skateboarders — that's just not right.'
    David_James_20100927071418_320_240.JPG


    70134_valshoot_17162621.jpg

    70135_valshoot_17162623.jpg
    http://www.tampabay.com/news/public...-duties-during-shooting-investigation/1124587
    http://www2.tbo.com/content/2010/se...ico-shooting-not-driving-schoo/news-breaking/

    :)
     
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    schnugee

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    My question based upon the description provided:

    So the victim yells at the CHP, begins a physical struggle with the CHP, and gets shot.

    And the Concealed Handgun Permitee is (innocent until proven guilty) assumed to be the bad guy? I agree that this is a sad situation, but am I the only one who thinks the "victim" behaved very poorly here?
     

    Speedlace

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    My question based upon the description provided:

    So the victim yells at the CHP, begins a physical struggle with the CHP, and gets shot.

    And the Concealed Handgun Permitee is (innocent until proven guilty) assumed to be the bad guy? I agree that this is a sad situation, but am I the only one who thinks the "victim" behaved very poorly here?
    The CHP holder came out with the handgun exposed.
    Open carry is illegal in Florida.

    The deceased yelled, then the guy pulled the gun out his waist and pointed it at the deceased. Then the deceased lunged for the handgun.

    I'm guessing he was arrested b/c he looks like the instigator. The guy he shot was unarmed and not attacking at the moment.

    Yelling doesn't rise to the level of a retort with deadly force.

    :)
     

    schnugee

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    Yelling doesn't rise to the level of a retort with deadly force.

    :)

    +1

    By no means am I trying to say that the CHP's behavior was ideal. Looks like very poor decision making at multiple points by both parties involved. It has been my experience that folks who yell after an arguement aren't known for saying things like, "Pardon me, sir! I couldn't help but notice that you are in the possession of a firearm! Have a fine day!"

    Pulling a firearm is a decision that shouldn't be arrived at lightly, by any means. It just seems to me, based upon the description, that the "victim" was the aggressor in this situation.

    I apologize if I am wrong in thinking this.
     

    herohog

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    had he pulled a gun on me in that same situation, I would have done my dead level best to relieve him of it or stop him in whatever manner I could as I WOULD be threatened! Don't pull it unleass you mean to use it AND YOU HAVE A DANGED GOOD REASON TO!
     

    charliepapa

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    What did being a bus driver have to do with anything?

    nothing more than the hippie who was a "Christian" and protesting the gun shop in an earlier thread. the media paints people in whatever light they want. maybe they wanted to humanize him a little and thought "school bus driver" was better than black or African American, which is the only thing you can really gather by just looking at the pictures.
     

    CEHollier

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    It will boil down to "self defense" and who can claim it. Mr. Dooley will claim because he was armed and Mr. James lunged at him he was defending himself. Mr. James side will claim because Mr. Dooly was armed he was the agressor and James lunged to protect himself. Either way it gives all CCP's a bad name. Mr. Dooly should have sat his ass at home and ignored the skateboarder. There was no need to bring/pull a pistol.
     

    Dave328

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    Gretna
    Air Force Veteran > Bus Driver

    They already tell you who you should think the good guy and the bad guy is.

    This^
    None of us were there, including the reporter writing the article. But putting their occupation was surely an attempt to prejudice public opinion. The alleged shooter being a bus driver has as much to do with the situation as the alleged victim being a veteran. Nothing. I've met my share of shitty bus drivers in my day, as I'm sure most of us all have, but I also know a couple veterans who are complete and utter douchebags,(one an active gang member and drug dealer while in) and I'm mystified by their Honorable discharges. The whole deal is a very unfortunate situation for all involved.:(
     

    sraacke

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    One thing the bus driver did right, he STFU. Remain Silent and get a lawyer. How many times have we heard it said over and over again?
     

    sraiford

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    charliepapa

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    One thing the bus driver did right, he STFU. Remain Silent and get a lawyer. How many times have we heard it said over and over again?

    yeah but he was also OC'ing which is what prompted the other guy to ask about the gun while he was walking away. If his gun would have remained unseen I doubt this would have escalated. he knew what he was doing; he allowed the gun to be seen and it proved a provocative move on his part. it just didn't turn out how he hoped it would.
     

    Jed

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    My question based upon the description provided:

    So the victim yells at the CHP, And the CHP pulls a handgun begins a physical struggle with the CHP, and gets shot.

    And the Concealed Handgun Permitee is (innocent until proven guilty) assumed to be the bad guy? I agree that this is a sad situation, but am I the only one who thinks the "victim" behaved very poorly here?

    fixed it for ya :)
    He should never pulled the pistol.
     
    Last edited:

    charliepapa

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    My question based upon the description provided:

    So the victim yells at the CHP, begins a physical struggle with the CHP, and gets shot.

    And the Concealed Handgun Permitee is (innocent until proven guilty) assumed to be the bad guy? I agree that this is a sad situation, but am I the only one who thinks the "victim" behaved very poorly here?

    it's because he had the CHP in the first place. the media wants you to believe that anyone who pre-meditates carrying a gun is always looking for someone to shoot, thus guilty ahead of time.

    notice also that they say he "marched" outside as opposed to simply walking. :rolleyes: obviously the reporter wasn't there to see the manner in which he transported himself to the basketball court, yet he tries to create a picture of a man on a mission by saying he was marching.
     

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