Agree to a point, but cops don't need an extractor to fail at the worst moment, because it was the cheapest possible part that could functionally be put in a rifle, to get the price point the lowest.
Gun Elephant In The Room $$$$$
- Thread starter 70mikenike70
- Start date
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You’re right. I over exaggerated a bit when I said the cheapest available. I’m sure we could find some monstrosities available for offering.
You lost me ..
70mikenike70
Well-Known Member
That’s exactly what I was thinking. Ok I need help here. He said that these other rifles, AKA low end rifles would not make it through combat…. Please help me understand how that is true. I joined the Army in 97 and the M16A2’s we were using were so old and used they almost looked like they had no anodized metal at all. These things were so beat up and old, but were still in use for us to train with. Man we beat the **** out of those rifles and not a single one ever broke, misfired, or had terminal problems. There was the occasional jam or miss feed and that was nor because the magazines were so old and way overused. These were regular Colt M16A2’s. Not BCM or all those high end jobs everyone is saying they only trust their life with. I’m talking we used these things as paddles, baseball bats, and bayonet thrashers. These rifles are made out of the exact same 7075 T6 aluminum as Bear Creek, Palmetto, Aero Precision, Daniel Defense, BCM, Knights Armament, and so on… I totally agree with the barrel comments. A barrel helps with accuracy for sure, but we could build a Palmetto and put a carbon fiber barrel on and it still wouldn’t be enough because fanboys would cry “It’s not name brand, it’s not BCM”…. Ok the popcorn just finished… Have at it boys!!!
I agree with you on several points. I own multiple Colts, they are tried and true and made well. You can beat them and use as boat paddles and they will function. Im with ya. You are also right, in the big picture the bolt and the barrel are the most important parts. But ancillary parts that are junk dont give support to those two critical parts. Sometimes its the little things too.
When you said "but we could build a Palmetto and..." that just means you are now defending a brand you support. Your points become less neutral and are slanted to a brand you represent or sell. Respectfully said.
Some stuff was said about PSA & Anderson that was not true though. They do not use inferior metals. They use the same metals as the other companies who source their blanks from Anchor Harvey. The difference is in the finish work and QC. Plenty of upper end companies have problems and break-in periods. When a "break in" period results in improper function...it's simply improper function, and the robber doesn't care. PSA/Anderson is not inherently less reliable or durable, it's just inexpensive and common...it's a basic b****, but it has good work ethic. Once a gun has been broken in, and any function flaws have been addressed, you're *mostly* just paying for a name and the finish work that might make a good gun better. Optics are a different story, furniture is too, but not when we're talking about commonly sourced metals from broadly shared sources.
Bigchillin83
Well-Known Member
Just me but I have never “broken in” any of my quality Ak,ar15, or factory Glock… and never had an issue, I Always assumed break-ins were for match grade long distance rifles or high $ sub moa rifles… I’m what I would consider a shooter… I Live on a larger plot of land in Livingston and have 2 ranges set up on my property including set up off the back porch lol…. And prob shoot a pistol or rifle at least 2-3 times a week…
That said the only issues I have ever had were 3 diff ar-15’s all Psa’s… extractor broke sub 300 rounds, 1 broken bcg cam pin, firing pin cotter pin…. Psa replaced both with no problem… that being said through the years I have been through prob 15 bcm’s and ddm4’s and never had 1 issue ever…. Would I own a psa again, yes sir, if I needed a budget shop gun, ect!!! For the money they are good choices. If you plan on shooting more than 1000 rounds a year I’d look into somthing else , which is prob only 1% of actual bayoushooter members
That said the only issues I have ever had were 3 diff ar-15’s all Psa’s… extractor broke sub 300 rounds, 1 broken bcg cam pin, firing pin cotter pin…. Psa replaced both with no problem… that being said through the years I have been through prob 15 bcm’s and ddm4’s and never had 1 issue ever…. Would I own a psa again, yes sir, if I needed a budget shop gun, ect!!! For the money they are good choices. If you plan on shooting more than 1000 rounds a year I’d look into somthing else , which is prob only 1% of actual bayoushooter members
My son still has a RR .
Chillin, I swear I was just about to type this when I read the above.
The term "break in period" is a laughable term by budget manufacturers that is more accurate to "time to break." The exception here is like an example of custom precision 1911's ...Yeah they have a break in period, they are so damm tight and over accurate you have to work the parts to let them set. Its the literal opposite of some of these guns.
Can you imagine any rational purchase when they told you that you had to use it for a while before it acted right ? Like the car dealer telling you after you got a brake job that you had to give it 1,000 miles before they were broken in and ready to actually do their job.
My current LWRC it on its second barrel (Well north of 40,000 rds) and had only broken a firing pin. It was actually still running, but with intermittent ignition. My Colts have had zero issues and I am well over 10-12,000 rounds on two of them. Its not what some people, who are invested in these budget brands, want to hear... but they need to at least be understanding of it.
It has its purpose. They all do.
Bigchillin83
Well-Known Member
I agree custom tight 1911’s also need break in… I think “break in’s” are a marketing skeem to give warranty/customer support a break…. You call them with your Anderson not ejecting and they tell you it needs to be broken in, they got a good chance of you putting it up and never shooting it, or selling it and either way you don’t bother them anymore 
70mikenike70
Well-Known Member
Roflol I’m not defending a brand I was simply stating I could use the so called low end rifle and make it a half MOA rifle.
Advanced, you post with bias to get people to use services you offer pretty often so maybe that is just a common human trait. We all tend to protect our dinner plates, and the things that fill them, whether we realize it or not.
Higher quality extractors and firing pins are part of the finish work that higher end companies focus on, and most of them do use better stuff than a basic PSA lower or BCG parts package. PSA isn't going to teflon coat the insides of their uppers either, finer finish work that some makers make sure to focus on. You can take a PSA, replace all of the failure prone parts of any AR (extractors, pins, certain springs) with higher quality parts, and with pretty minimal modifications have an AR that's on par with any other popular name brand.
LWRC & Colt also use Anchor Harvey forgings, BCM doesn't tell people who they use for stuff, and some of PSA's barrels are made by FN. There is a lot of "cousin kissing" in the parts supply world. lol
Just an example of a high end manufacturer that put out a rifle component with issues, it happens...and it does happen less with higher end stuff.
Higher quality extractors and firing pins are part of the finish work that higher end companies focus on, and most of them do use better stuff than a basic PSA lower or BCG parts package. PSA isn't going to teflon coat the insides of their uppers either, finer finish work that some makers make sure to focus on. You can take a PSA, replace all of the failure prone parts of any AR (extractors, pins, certain springs) with higher quality parts, and with pretty minimal modifications have an AR that's on par with any other popular name brand.
LWRC & Colt also use Anchor Harvey forgings, BCM doesn't tell people who they use for stuff, and some of PSA's barrels are made by FN. There is a lot of "cousin kissing" in the parts supply world. lol
Just an example of a high end manufacturer that put out a rifle component with issues, it happens...and it does happen less with higher end stuff.
Not really following here. Can you give examples of "you post with bias to get people to use services you offer pretty often"
I dont sell guns, in case you dont realize that. My services sure dont discriminate as to makes or models of guns. I dont care what they are or what they are made of. We work on anything. Curious what you mean..
I dont sell guns, in case you dont realize that. My services sure dont discriminate as to makes or models of guns. I dont care what they are or what they are made of. We work on anything. Curious what you mean..
You do SBR forms and there was a thread where you promoted going SBR rather than AR Pistol. If people took your advice it would be a business opportunity, for instance. It's not really any different than a person who sells PSA promoting PSA in a thread about DD. If someone else's opinion is less valueable due to self-interest, doesnt that extend to you when you do similar things?
WOW, now thats a spin I never ever would have thought to associate. I cant even fathom how SBR/AR pistol are related to a budget gunmaker with lesser quality parts versus a better quality type....But I guess that's your spin.
If I recall my post was that doing an SBR, before they become regulated and backed up in Form 1 world for years, was a good idea.
The actual comparison you are stretching for is if I compared my laser service to another company's services. Although I've never done that, it would be the comparison you want, I would think.
Have you thought of a career with MSNBC ? lol....
As I said. Good spin.
One has nothing to do with the other.
MSNBC is hiring though. Gotta leave your Palmetto in the car though.
