mixing kitty litter and... kaboom?

[Gator 45/70]

No sir, No menew's here.

Was it anywhere near kitty litter? That stuff is volatile!

 

[Vermiform]

So do I.

I know we just love to tell other people their (wrong) on forums but my post was to the
point of the oils mentioned not needing bleach as an aid to combust.

Had you read more than that post you'd
have seen that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[madwabbit]

still no clues. will update as relevant info comes my way, but it doesn't look like its going to get solved.


unless of course, this marshall turns around and highly impresses me.

 

[Tigerfish]

So do I.

I know we just love to tell other people their (wrong) on forums but my post was to the
point of the oils mentioned not needing bleach as an aid to combust.

Had you read more than that post you'd
have seen that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

And that is why my post was edited within 2 minutes to say what it does now. Read and you'd know that. I know we just love to tell other people they're wrong....

 

[The_Shadow]

Other oxidizers such as peroxides, potassium perchlorates, potassium nitrate, ammonium nitrate. when contaminated with other items or organic materials can spontaneously combust. Sulfuric and other acids, and even caustics like caustic soda, lye, Draino, can also react to liberated enough heat to ignite ordinary combustibles.

Batteries (AAA, AA, C, D and 9volt any automotive battery) can short out to generate enough heat to ignite ordinary combustibles and even explode.

It seems you all had quite a mix of stuff in the bin, but if it wasn't something disposed of that was that was already hot or smoldering like cigarette, charcoals, etc, then you may not pinpoint the exact cause.

Good luck and count your blessing things were not any worse.

 

[SicilianSecrets]

Hope you get to the bottom of the cause rabbit.

We had a can of crushed pineapple blow up in the pantry Friday, I'm still scratching my head over that one.

Botulism?

 

[sgt z]

I thought this was something about kitty litter and kaboom cereal. I couldn't figure that one out.

 

[Gator 45/70]

The wife and I decided that this had been on the shelf for a couple of years, I thought perhaps it fermented ?

Botulism?

 

[madwabbit]

Resurrection bump.

Mystery solved: it was some earth-clay based hippie kitchen cleaner and cooking oil. Got a call that "something smelled like burning plastic", opened our compactor and sure enough it was smoldering. Mixed some together in the back lot just to test again, took ~ an hour for it to light. Nothing in MSDS or online for either product stated flammable when mixed.

 

[kingfhb]

earth-clay based hippie kitchen cleaner and cooking oil

 

[Hitman]

The MSDS would be correct then.

They don't normally list reactions of what would happen 'if' on the MSDS.

Knowing the mix/reaction comes from knowledge of the chemicals themselves
something an MSDS doesn't exactly teach.

EDIT> Also if you recall, cooking oil doesn't need anything else to
generate heat anyway.

 

[TomTerrific]

EDIT> Also if you recall, cooking oil doesn't need anything else to
generate heat anyway.

What do you mean by this, HitMan?

For spontaneous combustion to occur, there has to be a chemical reaction liberating heat and a source of oxygen, along with other conditions.

I've had cooking oil in the pantry for decades and it didn't heat by itself.

It sounds as if the organization needs to segregate the trash with more care and I suspect/hope the Fire Marshall was misquoted.

I used to write MSDSs and they are not intended to be in depth treatises on the products involved. I got pretty good with weasel words. You have to convey a sense of danger w/o scaring the s**t out of everyone.

I am impressed with the content of this thread. Good job, guys!

 

[03protege]

Just noticed thread date..

 

[TomTerrific]

The MSDS would be correct then.

They don't normally list reactions of what would happen 'if' on the MSDS.

Knowing the mix/reaction comes from knowledge of the chemicals themselves
something an MSDS doesn't exactly teach.

EDIT> Also if you recall, cooking oil doesn't need anything else to
generate heat anyway.

There used to be a section where you listed "Avoid contact with:"

You have to really be careful with strong oxidizers like bleach and the various chlorine oxides. I've seen damp pool granules ignite visqueen.

The problem here seems to be contact of a strong oxidizer with fairly easily oxidized compounds in a container that allowed with build up of heat and subsequent combustion.

What is the bleach being used to clean?

 

[Hitman]

What do you mean by this, HitMan?

For spontaneous combustion to occur, there has to be a chemical reaction liberating heat and a source of oxygen, along with other conditions.

I've had cooking oil in the pantry for decades and it didn't heat by itself.

Exactly Tom, b/c your cooking oil in your pantry was missing key criteria
to spontaneously ignite.

My point is that the kitty litter did not need to be present
for the cooking oil to aid in the spontaneous ignition.

This is not something I can easily explain here in a post.

However the root of the issue is the decay of the oil,
the lack of air flow, but the presence of oxygen as well as
something to burn. (paper, paper towels, rags...etc)

I could google fu you some articles if interested.

Hydrocarbon oils generating heat while decaying is not a new thing.

Linseed Oil soaked rags in a barrel is the #1 culprit.
BUT! Linseed oil soaked rags laid out on a shop floor - nope.

EDIT> on MSDS's. Considering that the GHS now will supply an EXACT standard
for (SDS's) no longer MSDS's the sheets will all be to the same standard.

I've filed close to 5,000 MSDS's in the past 8 years
for products we processed where I work. I've seen all kinds
of sections on these sheets since some of them did not create it
according to OSHA's/ANSI's 16 Section standard.

 

[TomTerrific]

Got it HitMan.

Add wet hay to materials that spontaneously combust. Many a barn has burned down. As you indicated, several conditions need to be met for it to take place.

We burned down the Junior Achievement building in Gonzales with wet sawdust in a container.

 

[Hitman]

Got it HitMan.

Add wet hay to materials that spontaneously combust. Many a barn has burned down. As you indicated, several conditions need to be met for it to take place.

We burned down the Junior Achievement building in Gonzales with wet sawdust in a container.

HA! If another example was to be asked,
HAY was exactly what I was going to say!

 

[TomTerrific]

I think you will find oils like linseed are more reactive than ordinary aliphatic petroleum oils, which do react but aren't as reactive, if you get my gist.

 

[Magdump]

Pool shock and brake cleaner will combust FWIW.

its the glycerine in the brake fluid. Calcium hypochlorite and glycerine first makes a very noxious, poisonous smoke and then ignites.

I don't guess anybody ever considered a smoldering cigarette butt as the ignition source huh?