Shotgun for home defense?

[DAVE_M]

I overheard a conversation at a crawfish boil between a couple of guys discussing home protection while they were working out of town . One of the guys said he was going to get his wife a 12 ga pump with a pistol grip . I butted in and asked him if his wife had any experience with shotguns ? " Nope " . I told him he couldn't have dreamed up a worse choice in home protection for her if he tried . He just gave me a blank look and changed the subject . Well , I tried .

One range trip will change his opinion.

 

[SwampyDog]

One range trip will change his opinion.

Its probably the same guy that insists you can't miss with a shotgun and the slide racking will scare off the boogeyman

 

[machinedrummer]

Creepy Joe B. Has a very good instructional video and demonstrates the proper way to handle a threat with a super scary shotgun that actually has two barrels. I can’t believe that type of weapon isn’t on his ban list. Anyway anyone considering buying a gun for home defense should watch the video. Maybe someone could post it. It’s one of the best I’ve seen.

 

[DAVE_M]

Its probably the same guy that insists you can't miss with a shotgun and the slide racking will scare off the boogeyman

Jaws drop when they see what Flite Control 00 Buck looks like at 20 yards

 

[Mannelite]

I keep a pistol and a rifle adjacent to my bed, depending on what point I am alerted to a home intruder, I can grab either. They say having too many choices slows down your decision process, but the way I look at it: If I am awoken by someone in the process of breaking in, I probably have enough time to sling up my AK and maybe even throw on the plates as well. If I am awoken by someone either coming down my hallway or already in the house, I probably just grab my pistol because no time.

 

[Core]

Theres a reason the feds started using pistols for warrants by and large. The Marshalls used the SBR shotguns for high risk warrants. That tells us, logic dictates high risk = SBR given what professionals use. We used to use sub-guns and shotguns and now SBRs dominate for kinetic/killing efficiency.

I would prefer a pistol and a light or an SBR and a light myself. Shotguns are heavy and hungry. With respect to those on the video a pistol does not need to be extended to shoot an attacker at close range: point shooting dominates at close range including with SBR.

I prefer to use a pistol for conventional criminal threats. I was an industrial breacher for a period of time, and carried a shotgun with my tools. If you are encountering high risk threats you need more than a pistol. So use the pistol by your side to get to the SBR or shotgun. To me an SBR makes a shotgun obsolete all around. But a dedicated shotgun is hard to beat as long as you are well trained and can feed it.

 

[Bigchillin83]

Yup... it’s a game changer for sure... it has it’s purpose especially if you have a cylinder bore

Jaws drop when they see what Flite Control 00 Buck looks like at 20 yards

 

[DAVE_M]

Yup... it’s a game changer for sure... it has it’s purpose especially if you have a cylinder bore

Federal LE132 00 Buck out of my Remington 870 with a 18.5" Cylinder Bore barrel. At 20 yards, it's still a 6" pattern (within the A zone).

As far as the discussion of this thread, my scattergun is long. Longer than an SBR and much longer than a pistol at full presentation. I'm still playing with white light setups, but from my experience with my gun at night with my WML setup, having a front bead only sucks. It's difficult to see even in perfect conditions. This target is proof that you still need to aim a shotgun, so it's pretty useless if I can't see the sights in less than ideal conditions. Until I can acquire an Aridus CROM and equip it with a RDS, I'm not bothering with it as a home defense gun. That doesn't even touch on capacity or the skills needed to run a boomstick efficiently. I'm most proficient with the pistol I shove in my pants, so I'll stick with that.

 

[MOTOR51]

Federal LE132 00 Buck out of my Remington 870 with a 18.5" Cylinder Bore barrel. At 20 yards, it's still a 6" pattern (within the A zone).

As far as the discussion of this thread, my scattergun is long. Longer than an SBR and much longer than a pistol at full presentation. I'm still playing with white light setups, but from my experience with my gun at night with my WML setup, having a front bead only sucks. It's difficult to see even in perfect conditions. This target is proof that you still need to aim a shotgun, so it's pretty useless if I can't see the sights in less than ideal conditions. Until I can acquire an Aridus CROM and equip it with a RDS, I'm not bothering with it as a home defense gun. That doesn't even touch on capacity or the skills needed to run a boomstick efficiently. I'm most proficient with the pistol I shove in my pants, so I'll stick with that.

That’s seems to be the normal pattern with that ammo. It’s very impressive. Have you tried letting the hotspot of the weapon light assist you when aiming at closer distances. I’ve had a few lights that acted like a wider laser


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[Gator 45/70]

Federal LE132 00 Buck out of my Remington 870 with a 18.5" Cylinder Bore barrel. At 20 yards, it's still a 6" pattern (within the A zone).

As far as the discussion of this thread, my scattergun is long. Longer than an SBR and much longer than a pistol at full presentation. I'm still playing with white light setups, but from my experience with my gun at night with my WML setup, having a front bead only sucks. It's difficult to see even in perfect conditions. This target is proof that you still need to aim a shotgun, so it's pretty useless if I can't see the sights in less than ideal conditions. Until I can acquire an Aridus CROM and equip it with a RDS, I'm not bothering with it as a home defense gun. That doesn't even touch on capacity or the skills needed to run a boomstick efficiently. I'm most proficient with the pistol I shove in my pants, so I'll stick with that.

Well Dave that's not to shabby at all, Matter of fact that is rather great !

 

[Bigchillin83]

Beretta 1301 tactical 18.5” cylinder bore 3” flight control

 

[Magdump]

Beretta 1301 tactical 18.5* cylinder bore 3* flight control

And just imagine the devastation of that load hitting center mass all at once. I’ve shot a lot from 6 feet off the bore to 60 feet. 4 buck and 00 with the 12ga, 1 and 3 buck with the 20. Both 18.5 in cyl bore. Those sessions of shooting and measuring told me exactly what I needed to know about those guns and loads in my home.
Make no mistake, a shotgun will dump a hella lot of energy in one shot. In the event your assailant(s) are armed, the chances of them sending rounds even after you go to work on them are strong. I believe a shotgun blast to be more effective at submitting your assailant, period. Blowing out the spine is going to be an effective way to stop motor function. A head shot is also very effective. Pulling off either of these with a 9mm handgun might require a magdump vs one good hit from a shotgun. Ive seen quite a few head shots from pistols that were not lethal and did not end the fight or flight. I’ve seen 3 head shots with 9mm that caverned around the skull under the scalp and exited in the rear of the scalp without ever entering the brain pan. One did concuss the brain and one caused a very minor skull fracture. .38 to the frontal head at less than 3 feet caverned around and exited behind and above the ear. Patient played dead and got up and walked to find help after the shooter left. To tell the truth, a 22LR might stand a better chance of penetrating the human skull under some circumstances. Ive seen a few cases of shotgun blasts that never made it into the ER, a few that did. Most were DOA. A few made it to surgery and never made it home. I can watch vids all day with varying opinions from holy grail of home defense to don’t waste your time ya big dummy, but none of them hold a candle to seeing the results up close and personal. If you’re worried that you might miss with a shotgun, either practice or use something else, but be aware that you can miss with anything. I’m sticking with the shotgun.

 

[DAVE_M]

Furthest shot in my home is 18 yards. That’s a 5-6 inch pattern maximum. Shotguns still need to be aimed and the shooter must show some proficiency. Terminal ballistics of a 12 ga, especially 00 buck in an extremely tight pattern, are wonderful. However, I’m not relying solely on terminal ballistic performance for a home defense firearm. If that were the only factor, I would have a .50 BMG machine gun.

Clint Smith isn’t stupid. The video is a snippet of a long discussion. They are designed to be controversial and get people talking. There are a million factors into why you may choose one gun over the other. There is no right answer for everyone.

 

[Magdump]

I might have missed where someone argued that a shotgun throws a big pattern and covers a large area in this thread. I don’t see anyone repeating any of the misconceptions of using a shotgun for defense here as if they were fact. I’m pretty sure the pro shotgun people posting are aware of the factual performance of a shotgun and the difference between a shotgun and a 9mm pistol and a 5.56/.223 cal AR15 and that you have to aim at your target as with any other firearm. But there is a lot of good data out there from the fine print on boxes of ammo to FBI stats that can help someone make up their mind as to the effectiveness of a shotgun, including differences in 12 and 20 gauge. I’m pretty sure those here who have made the choice to include a shotgun in their home protection tool box have done so considering factual information rather than fanciful make believe or Hollywood special effects lore. I’m pretty sure that the number of outdoorsmen who choose a shotgun do so because they have already found some degree of proficiency with a shotgun and feel comfortable and confident using one to protect home and family. I have a strong feeling that many of those people will have a problem accepting much advice from anyone who does not share their choice or reasons for including a shotgun in their home protection weaponry, especially if it’s presumed that they are not proficient with the shotgun. Guess I’ll just keep an eye on this thread to see if I’m wrong.

 

[LACamper]

I will add that your attorney would probably prefer you use the shotgun over the tricked out AR when he has to defend you...

 

[DBMJR1]

If your shotgun patterns so poorly that 'you can't miss', then where are the pellets that don't hit the target going?

My shotgun will pattern about 3" at the distance the length of my hallway. I have to aim.

I'd have to aim with a pistol too, but because of the shorter sight radius, and the lack of a third point of contact, aiming with a pistol requires more concentration.

I'll stick with the boomstick and buck, and keep the pistols for backup and out of the house.

 

[Gator 45/70]

I might have missed where someone argued that a shotgun throws a big pattern and covers a large area in this thread. I don’t see anyone repeating any of the misconceptions of using a shotgun for defense here as if they were fact. I’m pretty sure the pro shotgun people posting are aware of the factual performance of a shotgun and the difference between a shotgun and a 9mm pistol and a 5.56/.223 cal AR15 and that you have to aim at your target as with any other firearm. But there is a lot of good data out there from the fine print on boxes of ammo to FBI stats that can help someone make up their mind as to the effectiveness of a shotgun, including differences in 12 and 20 gauge. I’m pretty sure those here who have made the choice to include a shotgun in their home protection tool box have done so considering factual information rather than fanciful make believe or Hollywood special effects lore. I’m pretty sure that the number of outdoorsmen who choose a shotgun do so because they have already found some degree of proficiency with a shotgun and feel comfortable and confident using one to protect home and family. I have a strong feeling that many of those people will have a problem accepting much advice from anyone who does not share their choice or reasons for including a shotgun in their home protection weaponry, especially if it’s presumed that they are not proficient with the shotgun. Guess I’ll just keep an eye on this thread to see if I’m wrong.

Shoot man, I roll from the hip, Just like yalls Dear Leader, 1st shot is to light up the hallway, 2nd shot is in the face !

3rd shot is because I like to watch body's bounce when they hit the floor....

 

[ozarkpugs]

Buck shot out of a rifled slug barrel does open up the pattern quite a bit but as someone previously mentioned the pellets that miss go somewhere . As far as the whole sbr v shotgun debate I would say that if you are going to panic and just point in the general direction and shoot a sbr offers faster misses and more bullets to miss with. I have trained in the dark with both at 7 yards and under and the oh sh!! time to first shot is a little faster with my mossberg than 6.8 AR pistol but the pistol shot is usually a little closer to center . Of course sequencal shots with mossberg are a lot slower. If I'm asleep it's dark and I don't intend to turn on the light to see sights . Red dot is great but practicing shooting without use of sight is greater. My choice is sbr / ar pistol if for no other reason because I can run it and make center hits with either hand and can not do so with my mossberg . I'm not just talking about the " if one hand is wounded " thing . I often wake up with one arm over my head or I will be laying on it and it be asleep . Does this ever happen to you and if you hear glass break and you can't move one arm what gun will you want handy ?

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[riverrat66]

I prefer my colt 45acp over the shotgun only because there will be less chance of hitting my dog. Im sure she will be all over bad guys ass before I get my pistol out. As for the wife its 12ga all the way. Don't know if she would think to aim in a panic situation.

 

[ozarkpugs]

I prefer my colt 45acp over the shotgun only because there will be less chance of hitting my dog. Im sure she will be all over bad guys ass before I get my pistol out. As for the wife its 12ga all the way. Don't know if she would think to aim in a panic situation.

For yours your dogs and her sake I hope she does aim .

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