Obama backs mosque near ground zero

[Mjolnir]

They hate us because we are not "believers". Islam calls on them to convert or kill all non-believers. It has nothing to do with foreign policy. Even if we had not assisted in helping form Israel, they would still hate us.

Kinda like the Old Testament and the Talmud, right? Right?

I know as Christian I don't believe in hatred, or worse, for non-Christians. Do you?

I don't see how one could divorce foreign policy when they openly state it due to foreign policy - overt military and political support for Israel and troops on Muslim soil. It's pretty damned simple. I don't see us divorcing our support from Israel but the troops could surely be brought home.

 

[Mjolnir]

Uh,........yeah they do. All Westerners alike.

Until the Muslim religion, if you want to call it that, takes responsibility for the actions of their people, stops using the pulpit to promote hatred towards non-muslims, and shows through their actions that they are a peace loving religion, I will consider ALL of them as my enemy, as I cannot tell the difference in the good ones and the evil ones.

I do not trust anyone of Arab decent. Every Muslim terrorist that had lived in the US had neighbors that vouched for them as model citizens, until their day came to do their part. My thought process tells me that any Muslim that is a good citizen today, may be the next suicide bomber tomorrow. I'm not going to accept any Arab as an American, until I see them stand up for American values, American culture, and American soverignty, and publicly denounce the dispicable actions of their culture.

And I don't see them doing that any time soon.

Our day will come, we need to throw out the liberals, replace them with true constitutionalists, and get to a liberaterian form of govt before we are nothing more than France, Italy, Germany, England, etc.; succumbing to the Musilms, and losing everything so many hundreds of thousands of men have given their life fighting for. Mark my words, in ten years the Muslims will rule all of Europe, and the US, if we don't face reality today.

rant over.

Sounds like bigotry and ignorance (really the same thing) to me. But if you're comfortable with it I guess it's "okay". One could easily replace the names of the groups and I "guess" it would still make sense.

 

[gbundersea]

The Muzzie a$$-licking on this thread is REALLY starting to get old.

PAPACHUCK nailed it. Ignore the vicious nature of these b@stards at your own peril.

 

[PAPACHUCK]

Sounds like bigotry and ignorance (really the same thing) to me. But if you're comfortable with it I guess it's "okay". One could easily replace the names of the groups and I "guess" it would still make sense.

I expected something of this sort from you.

Bigotry and ignorance? Please. Get your head out of your a$$ and see the real world.

It's called REALITY.

 

[PAPACHUCK]

Sounds like bigotry and ignorance (really the same thing) to me. But if you're comfortable with it I guess it's "okay". One could easily replace the names of the groups and I "guess" it would still make sense.

There are issues with some races and severe problems with others. For example, the black race. They only represent <20% of the population, but occupy <80% of the correctional institutions' bedspace and court dockets. They have a problem that will only be solved by persons within their own race. I do though trust them as a race, primarily 'cause I can assertain with some accuracy, whether or not a black person is dangerous or not.

The typical "thug", white, black, Hispanic, Oriental, etc. is not out to kill white people en' mass. Arabs are. Are there bad people in every race, sure. But as a race or religion, whichever you want to label them as, the Muslims/Arabs preach hatred towards me and you. (I'm gonna assume you're not a Muslim, and if you are.......)

It is a pie-in-the-sky attitude to think that all Muslims here in the US aren't part of the extremist movement. Are there some that are just good folks? Sure, probably quite a few. But I guarantee the percentage of good Muslims is way less than any other race on this planet. Like it or not, I don't care.

But don't call me a bigot or imply that I am ignorant because you have liberal tendancies and "just want everybody to get along", when the evidence and history shows the Muslim religion promotes and facilitates anti-western hatred.

 

[D-DAY]

Kinda like the Old Testament and the Talmud, right? Right?

I know as Christian I don't believe in hatred, or worse, for non-Christians. Do you?

I don't see how one could divorce foreign policy when they openly state it due to foreign policy - overt military and political support for Israel and troops on Muslim soil. It's pretty damned simple. I don't see us divorcing our support from Israel but the troops could surely be brought home.

So are you saying that if we remove our presence from the middle east and stop backing our only ally there, Israel, the entire Muslim world will then love us???


Secondly, do you really want to see an Israel that is unchecked??? You realize they will all fight to the death before they give up that little strip of land?

The Jews may be the only group of people alive that truly understand the muslim world and their end-game beliefs, so they have adapted accordingly. They would just assume kill themselves and everybody else around them before giving in to their enemies, and since they have the ability to do so the muslim world hates them for it.

ETA, I think you and many others misconstrue the principals of christianity. As Papachuck stated, this is an enemy that wants us force converted or to kill all those that refuse. You use the idea of Christ turning the other cheek as the core dogma of the religion and think that idea should be stretched over all circumstances. Nothing could be farther from the truth. When forced with either death or turning your back on Christ, do you really think all Christians should just accept slaughter?

 

[stancel]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjS0Novt3X4&feature=related[/ame]

 

[jmcrawf1]

^^^^^excellent

 

[D-DAY]

^^^^^excellent

+ 1 billion!

 

[Mjolnir]

PAPACHUCK and D-DAY, please tell us (or PM me) what you know of the Babylonian Talmud and what it says about those who aren't of the tribe. Tell me what it says about the property of those who are not of the tribe. I know neither of you can because if you could you'd not believe what you do and you certainly would not post what you post. That is a fact that I don't care if you choose to "believe" or not. Take the time to delve into it and you just may alter your tune a bit. Better yet; you can bank on it.

For the record I do not believe for a second that every Muslim is neutral (whether or not he/she is in the USA or not), much less an ally. Only a fool would (A) believe such a thing or (B) claim that I believe (or stated) such a thing. I don't care to hear, "but the way you talk..." WHERE DID I EXPLICITLY STATE IT? You cannot find it. Period.

Likewise, only a bigot would believe that EVERY Muslim is "outagetcha". It's a stupid belief on the face of it, really. But people are "free" to believe whatever the Hell they choose to. Just remember LIKE SEEKS LIKE...

Similarly, every Khazar (so-called Jew to the bulk reading this) is most certainly not a follower of the Babylonian Talmud. Only a wholly uninformed bigot would believe such a thing. And there's plenty who fit into this specific category of bigotry, too.

As for us leaving Saudi Arabia (specifically), Pakistan and Iraq I believe several of the tapes supposedly showing Osama bin Laden the individual states what I stated earlier. Now I know people "cut and paste" things to support their own preconceived positions on matters but if you believe the tapes are authentic then please go get the transcripts and read them carefully. The first Bin Laden Tape is *very* clear on this. Whether they "love" us or not means nothing to me. YOU don't "love" them so why would they "love" you? Hell, with the violence and rapaciousness in this country it could be argued that we don't love OURSELVES. Suffice it to say that it's been claimed many times over that "OBL" claims to that 9/11 happened because of our bases in Saudi Arabia.

D-DAY, you may wish to google "Political Zionism, Eretz Israel" concerning some very real reasons why the Islamic world is at odds with Israel. Look closely at the maps you'll eventually find. Then compare that map to the current maps of the Middle East. There is a problem because all of the lands between the Euphrates and the Nile are claimed by the Israelis. I think that Syria, Lebanon, Egypt (and, of course, the Palestinians) will have much to say about that.

Since I'm a Realist I realize that the two warring sides are not likely to find an amicable solution and thus will probably squabble over the land. Until, that is, someone gets hit seriously enough that the other (and her allies) escalate the conflict to a point where the others perceived allies further escalate the conflict eventually engulfing YOU AND I here in the USA. To me theres NOTHING in the Middle East that's worth even one American life. You may differ in your opinion.

 

[Cat]

I think we can call it ******** all day long if we want to.

But we can't pick and choose what Constitutional rights to bestow. This group, that group. It might suck, and it's probably grossly inconsiderate and it galls me to think of this becoming a victory monument (any many will use this to celebrate) but upholding our basic foundational rights becomes the most important when it becomes the hardest.

 

[Mjolnir]

I think we can call it ******** all day long if we want to.

But we can't pick and choose what Constitutional rights to bestow. This group, that group. It might suck, and it's probably grossly inconsiderate and it galls me to think of this becoming a victory monument (any many will use this to celebrate) but upholding our basic foundational rights becomes the most important when it becomes the hardest.

Agreed. But why in Hell would they even propose anything like that???? It makes little sense to me - unless it's another "divide and conquer" thing meaning it was never intended to go through but it can be used to further "rub the dogs' noses together". Just a thought.

 

[idunno]

Obama harkened back to earlier times when the building of synagogues or Catholic churches also met with opposition. "But time and again, the American people have demonstrated that we can work through these issues, and stay true to our core values and emerge stronger for it," he said. "So it must be and will be today."


Does anyone else see the irony of these words coming out of his mouth?

 

[oleheat]

Obama harkened back to earlier times when the building of synagogues or Catholic churches also met with opposition. "But time and again, the American people have demonstrated that we can work through these issues, and stay true to our core values and emerge stronger for it ," he said. "So it must be and will be today."


Does anyone else see the irony of these words coming out of his mouth?

Yep, I agree. The President and the majority of the Clowns in DC seem to know about as much regarding "our core values" as the average 3 year-old child.

Our Teleprompter-In-Chief has recited the "emerge stronger for it" line before as well, IIRC....

 

[Mjolnir]

Yep, I agree. The President and the majority of the Clowns in DC seem to know about as much regarding "our core values" as the average 3 year-old child.

 

[PAPACHUCK]

PAPACHUCK and D-DAY, please tell us (or PM me) what you know of the Babylonian Talmud and what it says about those who aren't of the tribe. Tell me what it says about the property of those who are not of the tribe. I know neither of you can because if you could you'd not believe what you do and you certainly would not post what you post. That is a fact that I don't care if you choose to "believe" or not. Take the time to delve into it and you just may alter your tune a bit. Better yet; you can bank on it.

For the record I do not believe for a second that every Muslim is neutral (whether or not he/she is in the USA or not), much less an ally. Only a fool would (A) believe such a thing or (B) claim that I believe (or stated) such a thing. I don't care to hear, "but the way you talk..." WHERE DID I EXPLICITLY STATE IT? You cannot find it. Period.

Likewise, only a bigot would believe that EVERY Muslim is "outagetcha". It's a stupid belief on the face of it, really. But people are "free" to believe whatever the Hell they choose to. Just remember LIKE SEEKS LIKE...

Similarly, every Khazar (so-called Jew to the bulk reading this) is most certainly not a follower of the Babylonian Talmud. Only a wholly uninformed bigot would believe such a thing. And there's plenty who fit into this specific category of bigotry, too.

As for us leaving Saudi Arabia (specifically), Pakistan and Iraq I believe several of the tapes supposedly showing Osama bin Laden the individual states what I stated earlier. Now I know people "cut and paste" things to support their own preconceived positions on matters but if you believe the tapes are authentic then please go get the transcripts and read them carefully. The first Bin Laden Tape is *very* clear on this. Whether they "love" us or not means nothing to me. YOU don't "love" them so why would they "love" you? Hell, with the violence and rapaciousness in this country it could be argued that we don't love OURSELVES. Suffice it to say that it's been claimed many times over that "OBL" claims to that 9/11 happened because of our bases in Saudi Arabia.

D-DAY, you may wish to google "Political Zionism, Eretz Israel" concerning some very real reasons why the Islamic world is at odds with Israel. Look closely at the maps you'll eventually find. Then compare that map to the current maps of the Middle East. There is a problem because all of the lands between the Euphrates and the Nile are claimed by the Israelis. I think that Syria, Lebanon, Egypt (and, of course, the Palestinians) will have much to say about that.

Since I'm a Realist I realize that the two warring sides are not likely to find an amicable solution and thus will probably squabble over the land. Until, that is, someone gets hit seriously enough that the other (and her allies) escalate the conflict to a point where the others perceived allies further escalate the conflict eventually engulfing YOU AND I here in the USA. To me theres NOTHING in the Middle East that's worth even one American life. You may differ in your opinion.

Oh, where do I start......

First and foremost, I never said EVERY Muslim is out-to-getcha, but that I do not trust ANY Muslim, and I stand by that statement. Similarly, I know every Pit-Bull dog is not bad, but I'm not gonna let my grandkids play with one until I know that it's not dangerous, or not at all. That is NOT bigotry. That is using common sense. One cannot say with certainty that a Muslim person is NOT a terrorist by chance of meeting, nor after many years of knowing them. More terrorists are Muslims than any other race, their beliefs mean our demise, and they don't wear a tag letting me know if they are a good Muslim or a bad one. Common sense tells me not to trust them all.

Second, I don't really care what the Babylonian Talmud has to say, I'm not of that culture. Printed words don't seem to matter to those who strap bombs on their children in the name of Allah. If you want to imerse yourself into their (or your) culture, feel free, it is still a free country. Don't expect me, or most red-blooded Americans to have any sympathy for you or your pro-Muslim brethran. Read what you want, spew what you want, The Muslims' faith allows for the existance of the radicals within their ranks, and until they, as a whole, condemn the killing of non-believers, I will treat every Muslin as my enemy. PERIOD.

Do you own a turban?

 

[rebelray84]

Mulims are not now,nor will they ever be our,friends.They are our enemy and should be treated as such.The same goes for followers of the Talmud.We,as a nation,need to come to our collective senses and understand this or we will be destroyed as a free nation.

 

[stancel]

Why is the Constitution being brought into this argument?? Politicians could care less about the Constitution, and they prove it on a weekly basis. We go to war in direct violation of the Constitution. We loose gun rights in direct violation of the constitution. We are taxed on our labor which is in direct violation of the Constitution. Yet now all of a sudden, everybody wants to get all sensitive about making sure these pukes who want to build this abomination at ground zero have their Constitutional rights protected.

You know what I say? F their Constitutional rights!!! Mine get dumped on every day, so why not theirs? Why is it OK to violate my rights, but not theirs?

Mjolnir, I am also very critical of America's foreign policy. I have spent years reading about our interventions in other sovereign nations. I am not defending those acts. But I am not going to use the acts of our tyrannical government to defend what is going on at ground zero. What our government and CIA have done around the world wont matter when a Father who lost his child has to see a giant Mosque built on top of the memory of his son or daughter.

These are all just my opinions, as warped as lots of people think they are.

 

[Mjolnir]

Oh, where do I start......

Second, I don't really care what the Babylonian Talmud has to say, I'm not of that culture. Printed words don't seem to matter to those who strap bombs on their children in the name of Allah. If you want to immerse yourself into their (or your) culture, feel free, it is still a free country. Don't expect me, or most red-blooded Americans to have any sympathy for you or your pro-Muslim brethran. Read what you want, spew what you want, The Muslims' faith allows for the existance of the radicals within their ranks, and until they, as a whole, condemn the killing of non-believers, I will treat every Muslin as my enemy. PERIOD.

Do you own a turban?

Therein lies the key isn't it? Self-imposed ignorance. Thanks for admitting what I already knew.

All three (Koran, Bible and Talmud) allow and in some caees encourage radicals within their ranks; apparently you don't read the so-called holy books. But you "know all about" Islam".

Clue: there is Wahabbism and there is Islam. I guess it won't matter much if you advocate a Crusade as they'll all have issues with you then.

Oh, quit hiding your yarmulke. Whether you accept them or not they won't ever accept you.

 

[D-DAY]

Therein lies the key isn't it? Self-imposed ignorance. Thanks for admitting what I already knew.

All three (Koran, Bible and Talmud) allow and in some caees encourage radicals within their ranks; apparently you don't read the so-called holy books. But you "know all about" Islam".

Clue: there is Wahabbism and there is Islam. I guess it won't matter much if you advocate a Crusade as they'll all have issues with you then.

Oh, quit hiding your yarmulke. Whether you accept them or not they won't ever accept you.

Please by all means, tell me where in Christ's teachings he encouraged radicals on par with the radicals of the nation of Islam???

As far as Israel and the middle east, are you saying that if Israel were to give back the disputed lands that they will be accepted by Islam and all will be well in the region? That is laughable! The Muslim world wants Israel eradicated and entire control over their land.

If I am wrong, then please tell us what would make the muslim world happy to where they would stop attacking the interests of the western world and Israel? How do we get to a more permanent peace with them???